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revjohn

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Noah

HI All,

 

Last night I went with my son and wife to see Noah.  My wife loves going to the movies, my son much more so.  They usually go together and see whatever dreck has just been released.  My son, who does not attend Church for a number of reasons connected to particular expression of ASD was very intent upon me coming to see this particular movie because, well, Noah is a Biblical tale and that is right down my alley.

 

Warning, this is going to contain spoilers.

 

First things first, while Noah is a Biblical tale this particular telling takes liberties.  A lot of them.  Most of the liberties taken serve only to drive the conflict essential to the plot.  That said, the liberties taken do force the viewer to consider some very deep messages which find their genesis in the Bible as a whole.

 

So . . . 

 

The movie opens with an attempt to give us some background to the primary conflict.  Creation is mentioned, no details.  The Fall is mentioned, serious little detail.  Adam and Eve have three sons Cain, Abel and Seth.  Cain slays Abel and the primary conflict driving the film is the conflict between the sons of Cain and the sons of Seth.

 

The sons of Cain are technology driven.  Knowledge imparted to Cain by the Watchers (fallen Angels--more to follow) allows them to become smiths of metal and makers of things (mostly destructive things).  The sons of Seth are more agrarian, gatherers but not hunters nor farmers.  They are also Vegan.

 

With that out of the way we find ourselves in the presence of Lamech and his son Noah.  Lamech is taking Noah through some ritual which involves what appears to be a bit of snakeskin (magical snakeskin at that)  Lamech wraps it around his left hand and forearm and the snakeskin begins to glow and the ritual begins when Lamech and Noah are alerted to the presence of several men.

 

Lamech warns Noah to remain hidden and goes out to meet the approaching strangers.

 

Enter Tubal-Cain (played by Ray Winstone).  Tubal-Cain recognizes that Lamech is a son of Seth and their is a confrontation.  Tubal-Cain takes the snakeskin from Lamech's arm.  Insults the Creator and then stikes him in the head with an axe.  Beginning a celebration over the death of the last son of Seth that allows Noah to escape into the wilderness.

 

Years pass.

 

Next we see Noah with his sons Shem and Ham.  They are out looking for something.  They find some mystical element called zohar.  Zohar looks like gold, whack it with something hard enough and it ignites and a pinch of the stuff can be used to discern pregnancy (thoughts on zohar later).  Noah is shocked when a drop of rain strikes the earth in front of him and a small flower springs suddenly into existence.  He puzzles over this but does not have long to do so.

 

While Noah, Shem and Ham are out foraging a creature stumbles close by.  It has the lines of a large dog, the ear tufts of a lynx and is covered with something like feathers.  It has also been wounded by hunters.  The three of them claim that Noah is messing with their kill, Noah removes the spear head from the now dead animal, warns Shem and Ham to leave and he remains to confront the three hunters who move toward him aggressively and contemptuously.

 

Gladiator happens and Noah is triumphant.  All three hunters are dead.

 

The creature at least (don't see the bodies of the hunters) is respectfully cremated and Noah and Sons return to their camp where we meet Mrs. Noah (Naamah) and their infant son Japheth.  Noah shares with Naamah the incident with the hunters, sans his spirited defence of life and limb.  Naamah asks how the boys responded to the hunting and Noah fearfully recalls that Ham was fascinated by it. (setting up conflict between Ham and Noah).

 

Night falls.  

 

Noah sleeps.  

 

God speaks.

 

Not with words but in a dream.  Noah sees a mountain.  Notes he is standing in a bloody field and then is suddenly below water while millions of drowned bodies float in the water beside him.  He struggles to swim to the surface, only to wake.

 

Stepping outside his tent into the rising sun of morning he ponders.  Naamah wakened by his retreat from the tent goes out to him and asks if God has spoken.  Noah is certain he has but he doesn't understand much of what he has seen.  He recognizes the mountain that he has seen in his dream and decides it is time to go and visit grampa Methuselah.

 

So, the family packs up and heads out.  Naamah mentions that they will have to pass by cities.  Noah is not thrilled but thinks they might be able to avoid them.  Walking along they come to an abandoned zohar mine and not it is littered with bodies.  Naamah wants to go another way but Noah decides to head straight on through.  Shem notices movement, a young girl has been terribly wounded.  Naamah tends to the wounded girl whose name is Ila.  

 

Bandits arrive, Noah scoops up Ila, as Naamah has the infant Japheth to lug around and everybody hauls backside.  The Bandits give chase, the fleeing heroes come to a bizarre line of rocks and markers pause for a moment to contemplate options (clearly they understand this a warning) and, as the bandits draw near they flee pass the markers in a desperate attempt to gain safety.

 

Most of the pursuing bandits stop at the markers a few continue despite warning from their comrades.  A pile of rocks comes to life, flattens the unwise bandits violently and Noah, turning to see what is going on gets pummelled himself.

 

Apparently it is a just a love-tap because he regains consciousness later on to find himself and his family in a pit.  While he is wondering about getting out we hear more rock on rock grinding and suddenly around the edge of the pit we see more of these walking piles of rock.  They don't much care for humans and the leader? reads a list of grievances to Noah as evidence of how warped and twisted his kind are.  They aren't going to kill Noah and his family, they are going to leave them in that pit to die.

 

And that is that.

 

Night falls and suddenly there is a rock creature in the pit with them.  Follow me it says and off they go.

 

The rock creatures are Watchers and this is their story:  They were created on the 2nd day of Creation, so they have been around and seen lots.  They witnessed the fall of Adam and Eve and after the expulsion from the garden these beings (if you haven't guessed-they are angels) rebelled against God to provide assistance to Adam and Eve.

 

Their punishment?  As they fly to earth they suddenly become heavy and physical beings, they experience fiery re-entries into the earths atmosphere and strike the earth like falling stars (clever eh?  Check out day 2 of Creation--oops that should have been day 4 if you are going by Genesis).  

 

So anyway these falling stars hit the earth and the rock in their impact craters melts to their bodies until it eventually cools.  Watchers then are fallen angels trapped in rock.  And this one Watcher has decided that Noah is telling the truth.  The Creator has spoken to him and so he must help Noah to fulfill his calling.

 

They arrive at the base of Methuselah's mountain.  Noah takes Shem with him orders the watcher to keep Naamah and the others safe and goes looking for grampa.

 

Methuselah (played by Sir Anthony Hopkins) is easily one of the most likeable characters in the film.  He also has some bizarre abilities.  Chatting with Shem his great grandson he asks about his favourite thing in creation.  Shem likes berries.  Methuselah is delighted.  Berries are wonderful.  "Did you bring your grandfather any?"  Shem sheepishly admits he has none.  That's alright says Methuselah who runs a finger across Shem's brow putting him to sleep and motioning to Noah decides it is time they talk about things Shem need not hear.

 

Noah recalls the dream.  "What next?" asks Methuselah handing Noah some tea.  Noah doesn't know.  Then he gets all woozy looks into the cup and finds out that Grampa has drugged him.  Grampa admits it and is not apparently bothered that this has become known.

 

Noah sleeps.

 

God speaks.

 

In the dream there are some new elements.  First, there is some seed in the bottom of his tea cup, which he plants and as soon as it is planted becomes a geyser of water and then Noah is holding breath in a great sea with bodies floating.  The seed floats by him in the water heading for the surface where it quickly spreads and becomes the ark.  Now instead of drowned bodies floating around it is a mass of creatures swimming for the surface, to the bottom of the ark which spits open as beams of light pour out.

 

So Noah percieves that God will destroy the earth by flood and that he is to build an ark to save the animals.

 

Returning down the mountain he fills Naamah in on the story and they go to sleep.

 

Early the next morning Noah plants the seed from his dream.  Methuselah happened to have one on his person.  It came from the garden and it is the last of its kind.  Shortly after the seed is planted and Noah and others are standing around the rest of the Watchers arrive.  They begin to drag away their companion unhappy that he has been hanging out with scum like humans.

 

Noah intervenes when suddenly the seed which Noah planted erupts.  A fountan of water sends streams of water this way and that.  I counted four.  Coincidence I guess.  As Noah and family and the Watchers boggle at this event trees erupt on both banks of each of the four streams and we get soem very brief time-lapse esque treatments of the streams flowing this way and that and a forest growing in their wake.

 

The watchers are impressed.  They decide that they will help Noah fulfill his task.

 

Which explains how Noah comes up with ship-building know-how and the labour to build such a monumental structure.  He has the help of Fallen Angels wrapped in rock.

 

More time-lapse following the streams still progressing and some years pass.  Noah is older.  Shem and Ham are young adults, Ila a beautiful young woman bearing a striking resemblance to that Granger kid at Hogwarts and Japheth is pre-teen.

 

Shem and Ila are running through the forest.  Frolicking as young people are want to do.  Things get frisky, and suddenly Ila puts the breaks on.  We find that her wound has healed but still is painful to the touch and beside that she is barren.  A branch snaps (sure sign of trouble) and the two notice Ham a little way off spying on them.  Shem is about to chase Ham off when a flock of birds swarms overhead.

 

They are headed for the ark.  Two of every kind.  We get to fly along in the flock with them.  We fly into the ark with them.  We stand in the ark as they fly past.  It is very visual and despite the fact it is CGI not that badly done.

 

So, now what to do with all these birds in this ark?  How will we feed them and clean up after them.  This presents a real and truly daunting challenge.  Never mind.  Naamah can whip some herbs together that we can burn to create an incense that puts birds into a very deep sleep but has no effect on human beings.

 

Herbs are great that way.

 

Ham has noticed something and it bothers him.  All of the birds have mates.  Noah has Naamah and Shem apparently has Ila, where are wives for he and Japheth?  God will provide all that is needed says Noah and that is enough for that day.  Noah, it appears is not that great a conversationalist and he doesn't appear to communicate well with Ham.  Ham needs to go for a walk.

 

While out walking he hears the sound of girls.  So intent is he on finding them he is completely taken by surprise by some strange man of evil intent.  Before the strange man can harm Ham he (the strange man) is felled by a particularly vicious hammer blow to the melon.  Company, it appears, is coming.

 

Great flocks of birds are hard to miss.  

 

Tubal-Cain didn't miss them and he follows them to the Ark, which he mistakes for a stronghold.  To be fair there is no water nearby and it looks more like a box than a boat.  Along the way he runs into Ham who is in a spot of trouble with some ruffian and Tubal-Cain solves the problem the way his father solved his.  By striking it dead.

 

Ham is shocked so Tubal-Cain offers him his war hammer and makes sure none of his people dares to harm Ham.  Together they walk to the ark where Tubal-Cain claims it for himself.

 

Noah denies the claim so Tubal-Cain decides to take matters into his own hands.  He has men at his back and Noah, he believes, is alone.  I am not alone, says Noah.  The Watchers, suspicious of men, have done their very best camoflage routine and resemble piles of rock scattered abround the work space.  When Tubal-Cain signals violent intent they spring into being and action.

 

Which brings things to a halt right there.  Tubal-Cain is not prepared to deal with Watchers but he will be back.

 

In the meantime the things that creep and slither arrive.

 

They are also put into suspended animation much as the birds.  Still no effect on people.

 

Ham is still wound up about having no wife for himself and Japheth.  Naamah talks to Noah and Noah goes to find wives.  Here Noah gets a glimpse of the sin of man.  Women are dragged off and traded for meat which is set upon quickly and eaten raw.

 

Noah, is repulsed and has a vision of fire reigning down on the city and burning it to the ground.

 

He comes home without wives for Ham and Japheth which creates more trouble between him and his second son.  Meanwhile Shem and Ila are still getting cuddly but Ila's barrenness is still a stumbling block.  Ila goes to Noah and asks him about finding wives for his sons, wives who can bear children.  Noah is thinking that isn't necessary.  His vision doesn't lead him to believe that the Human race shall be saved.  He and Naamah will die, Shem and Ila will die.  Ham will die and finally Japheth will die and the corrupting problem of Creation will disappear.

 

Naamah has other ideas.  She goes to see Methuselah and talks to him about Ila's barrenness.  Methuselah considers this but makes no promise.

 

The beasts arrive and are introduced to nap-time

 

Ham, meanwhile grows impatient and bitterly jealous of Shem's happiness and resentful at his fathers lack of concern in his loneliness he decides to go and find a wife for himself.  Ila chases after him and a short while later Noah sends Shem to find them both and bring them back.  Time is getting short.

 

The city that Ham then finds himself in is a terrible place and a wrong turn plunges him into a mass grave where he meets Na'el (rhymes with Jor-el but that is not important right now).  Ham and Na'el get off to a rocky start (meeting in a mass grave is not an ideal first date).

 

Ila has no luck finding Ham.  She does happen across Methuselah and they have a pleasant chat.  It comes to a conclusion when Methuselah wonders why, after all the time she has been on his mountain she has not dropped by for his blessing.  He touches her stomach, Ila feels weird.

 

Shem calls for Ila, Methuselah tells her to go to him.  And she does, with abandon.

 

Then it starts to rain.

 

Tubal-Cain is ready to attack Noah and seize the arc along with all the meat inside it.  Ham and Na'el are running just ahead of the mob when Na'el steps into a leg-hold trap with painful consequences.  Ham stuggles to free her and is momentarily relieved to see Noah running towards him.  Noah grabs Ham, apologizes to Na'el and drags Ham away.  The on rushing mob tramples the poor girl to death and right about then Ham has had enough of his old man.  He is separated from Noah by the mob but manages to get back to the Ark ahead of everyone else.

 

Meanwhile the Watchers have been preparing for this final defence.  And as the rains fall these fallen angels go to war against the onrushing armies of the sons of Cain.

 

The Watchers have shown through the movie that they constantly beg and plead with God for forgiveness for what they have done.  They also constantly mention the silence of God.  Here in this moment of desperation they are prepared to lay down their lives so that Noah's mission may be filled.

 

One by one the Watchers fall.  The first to fall is overwhelmed by men with spears.  The spears penetrate the rock to the angelic being within and they experience pain.  As the first Watcher falls on his back with Tubal_Cain atop him driving a metal spear deeper and deeper he looks to the heavens and wonders about mercy.

 

We see what the Watcher sees, nothing but swirling cloud above, though it parts ever so slightly.  The Watcher then erupts and out of the explosion a beam of light rises to the heavens.  God is merciful after all and this Watcher, freed from his rock prison is welcomed home.

 

The battle wages on and more Watchers fall in eruption after eruption.  The rain falls harder and with one final Watcher standing guard it looks like Tubal-Cain will prevail.  The final watcher turns to Noah blesses him then begins to pry the rocks imprisoning hims apart with his own hands causing one final explosion and buying Noah seconds.

 

It won't be enough.  Something more is needed.  Men are now clambering onto the Ark.  Noah has gone gladiator again and is fighting them off but this can't go on forever.

 

Suddenly the vaults of the earth open and geyser after geyser erupts sending the onrushing armies hither and thither.  Tubal-Cain has found another way to the ark and is busy trying to make a back door when the first wall of water strikes the arc.

 

Noah gets inside, shuts the door and they wait out the storm.  Listening to the cries of panic and desperation outside.  Naamah and Ila beg him to offer some kind of aid.  Noah will have none of it.

 

So, were all sitting on this ark, in the dark.  Ham is furtively nursing Tubal_Cain back to health and Noah tells the story of Creation.  With details this time.  We follow the first bit of life in the deeps as it evolves from single cell to multi-cell from invertebrate to invertebrate from living below the waters to living upon the dry earth to swinging from trees in an ape-like form until the sixt day and the screen is filled with bright light masking what would be the final evolution.

 

Or so you'd think

 

Adam and Eve standing before the tree robed in light.  Puzzling over the dried and abandoned skin of the serpent who tempts.

 

That snakesking thing Tubal-Cain took from Lamech wasn't snakeskin at all.  It was the light that fell from Adam and Eve after they were kicked from the garden.

 

Were Adam and Eve fabricated from the dust of the earth or a product of evolution?  Neither, they are the embodiment of zohar.

 

So.

 

Not the most Biblical, Biblical movie ever made.

 

Nor is it the most unbiblical Biblical movie ever made.

 

Thought prokoking and very interesting though quite a departure from the narrative we know best.

 

More to follow.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

 

 

 

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paradox3's picture

paradox3

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Didn't read past the spoiler alert because I might want to see it. Do you recommend it, RevJohn?

Saul_now_Paul's picture

Saul_now_Paul

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Kimmio's picture

Kimmio

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SnP how'd you get that so soon? Is it the same Noah movie as the OP? I don't think I want to click on it. I'd rather see it in the theatre.


Rev John, thanks for posting. I only read half way down because it looks like you explained the whole movie (very detailed, good memory for all those names. I guess your Biblical education helps! I have trouble, if there are a lot of unfamiliar sounding names in movies, remembering them all) - not just some spoilers, there! I might want to see it, too. Looks entertaining.

waterfall's picture

waterfall

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The movie industry has now put out a few 'biblical movies", is this just another way of profiting off Gods' word or is it another form of evangelism? Should anyone have to pay to see a movie that is biblical or should it be free? I don't know the answer to that, just asking. In the meantime I will probably rent it later.

waterfall's picture

waterfall

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Kimmio, it's not the movie. It's an interview of different people answering various questions.

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi paradox3,

 

paradox3 wrote:

Didn't read past the spoiler alert because I might want to see it. Do you recommend it, RevJohn?

 

I do.

 

Those who are anal about the story adhering exactly to the four chapters in Genesis that contain it will not enjoy it because there are significant liberties taken.

 

Those who are able to listen to the substance and get past the surface should find it to be a very provocative piece which rang my theological bells for the attention it paid to themes of grace and forgiveness.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi Kimmio,

 

Kimmio wrote:

Rev John, thanks for posting. I only read half way down because it looks like you explained the whole movie (very detailed, good memory for all those names. I guess your Biblical education helps! I have trouble, if there are a lot of unfamiliar sounding names in movies, remembering them all) - not just some spoilers, there!

 

Well, I'm familiar with the source material and had seen interviews with Aronovsky where he was quite open about taking liberties.

 

In a side by side comparison with Gibson's The Passion of the Christ which takes liberties with the Biblical text it is the least gratuitous of the two.

 

Every liberty taken in Noah, for example, leads back to something inherent to the conflict presented.  Some go through a more fanciful route others less so.

 

Kimmio wrote:

I might want to see it, too. Looks entertaining.

 

It moves at a good pace.  It isn't as frenetic as the Lord of the Rings or the Hobbit movies.  It clocks in a 2 hrs and 9 minutes so it is a bit of a sit but not so long your butt cramps.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi waterfall,

 

waterfall wrote:

The movie industry has now put out a few 'biblical movies", is this just another way of profiting off Gods' word or is it another form of evangelism?

 

Ask Creflo Dollar he'll tell you that you can do both at the same time.

 

I don't know why Aranovsky wanted to make this movie or why the theatres gave it a green-light.  I expect the returns on The Wrestler and The Black Swan helped smooth the ride for this film to be made.

 

waterfall wrote:

Should anyone have to pay to see a movie that is biblical or should it be free?

 

The script (broadly speaking) might be free domain but if you want headliners to act in it you need to pay them for their effort.  Russell Crowe doesn't come cheap nor, do I expect that Anthony Hopkins comes half-off.  Jennifer Connelly (who played opposite Crowe in "A Beautiful Mind" gave a very strong performance.  Emma Watson who played opposite Douglas Booth (Ila to Shem) raised her game to very mature Hermione Granger.

 

Whatever they payed Crowe and Hopkins they could have doubled and still had a deal.

 

Ray Winstone did well as Tubal-Cain but the character is more bully and thug than anything else so we don't need a range of emotion from him.

 

If we swapped out A-listers for  the WonderCafe.ca players it wouldn't have the same draw.

 

waterfall wrote:

I don't know the answer to that, just asking. In the meantime I will probably rent it later.

 

I'm wrestling with whether I will take that route with Peabody and Sherman.  I've seen them on the small screen dozens of times already though.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

Hilary's picture

Hilary

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revjohn wrote:

Hi paradox3,

 

paradox3 wrote:

Didn't read past the spoiler alert because I might want to see it. Do you recommend it, RevJohn?

I do.

 

Thanks.  I do not see a lot of movies in the theatre; I usually wait until I can get them free at the library.  Is this one of those fantastically beautiful ones that really should be seen on the big screen?

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi Hilary,

 

Hilary wrote:

Is this one of those fantastically beautiful ones that really should be seen on the big screen?

 

Well, there are some scenes that really require a grandness of scale to be able to appreciate.  That said, I don't think that this will be seriously limited by conversion to a smaller screen.

 

Most of the intense scenes are more close up in nature than panoramic.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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"Gladiator happens..."

 

*giggle*

 

another retelling of ancient tales that stretch way past Babylon...Neolithic flowers in dead one's graves retold, humans and skies retold becoming heroines becoming divine retold becoming plus ultra divine...each retelling a seed that produces a geyser of story because of the previous prophetic dream (retelling)...

 

i LOVE that image of the meteorite angels!

 

how's the CGI?  i'm really impressed at how real CGI can be now...like with the Croods & Rango...

 

my favourite Noah (that Babylonian) is still Evan Almighty...such a sweet show

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi InannaWhimsey,

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

i LOVE that image of the meteorite angels!

 

The idea was very interesting.  Sadly for most ot their onscreen activity the CGI was not convincing.  The watchers are easily the most disappointing effect in the film.

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

how's the CGI?  i'm really impressed at how real CGI can be now...like with the Croods & Rango...

 

CGI is hit or miss.  In a completely CGI environment (ie., avatar) you get consistent lighting.  When you add a CGI effect to an otherwise live environment there are inconsitencies which result (for me at any rate) in a disjointed whole.

 

There are, apparently, no live animals in Noah.  Every animal is CGI and in some scenes it works where in others it doesn't.

 

The birds for example don't quite fly.  The wing construction is way too rigid.  Add to that the inconsistencies in lighting and it is more of a distraction.  Fortunately it is a brief sequence.

 

The things that creep and the beasts of the earth were also obviously synthetic.

 

The ark upon the waters was very well done.

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

my favourite Noah (that Babylonian) is still Evan Almighty...such a sweet show

 

Can't really go wrong with Steve Carrell.  Espectially if you are going for laughs.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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revjohn,

 

got any favourite bibble movies?

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi InannaWhimsey,

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

got any favourite bibble movies?

 

The Ten Commandments.  Although that is less for the subject matter and more for the dialogue.

 

Favourite lines include:

 

Dance you mud turtles!

 

Memnet must have walked that balcony a thousand times.

 

Those who will not live by the law, Die by the law!!!

 

Plus any line by Edward G Robinson who is very slimy as Dathan.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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I think the best Biblical movie I have seen is Prince of Egypt.  Yeah it is animated.  Apart from that the call of Moses blew me away.  It was very powerfully executed.

I did not enjoy Gibson's The Passion of Christ.  The raindrop scene was probably the best part of the whole film.

 

My favourite bit of Noah was while they were on the ark and Noah tells the story of Creation and the Fall.  I imagine that Aronofsky probably upset both Creationists and Evolutionists with that bit of story telling which is very reflective of Jewish commentary.

 

It was years ago that I saw "The Last Temptation of Christ" it didn't offend me nor did it really impress me.

 

Apart from that I can still remember lyrics from Jesus Christ Superstar.

 

Campus Crusade For Christ released a film sometime ago simply called Jesus.  It was very faithful to one of the gospels and dry as dust.  The acting and cinematography were not at all impressive.

 

Haven't watched the Burnett-Downey stuff.  Touched by an Angel drove me right up the wall.  Same for Highway to Heaven.  The maudling sentimentality of both series churns my stomach.

Kimmio's picture

Kimmio

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Did you see the Gospel of John? What'd you think? I had less Bible study then than I do now, which still isn't tons, but I remember it being authentic to how I picture the stories. It wasn't particularly sensational or huge budget but I was moved by a few scenes. Good casting for Jesus, a little bit roguish, although I am not sure that Jesus was as handsome as he's always portrayed to be in movies. He may have been but it's likely too, that he wasn't. We just can't seem to get past that Western ideal/ iconic looking Jesus. It doesn't sell movies.

Kimmio's picture

Kimmio

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revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi Kimmio,

 

Kimmio wrote:

Did you see the Gospel of John?

 

Not yet.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

Birthstone's picture

Birthstone

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Good to see your review John.  For the record (as a PK) I hated Touched by an Angel, Highway to Heaven and Seventh Heaven too- ick!!  I didn't say it often because it seemed like everyone else in the entire world liked them, but maybe it was too much saturation for me.

So the hardest idea in Noah has always been for me that God decided to kill everyone in the first place.  Does God change Gods mind, or is it assumed that God has that right?  Or is the movie shown from God's perspective at all,or just the people deciding it must be God?   Curious - could make or break it for me.

 

 

 

 

revjohn's picture

revjohn

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Hi Birthstone,

 

Birthstone wrote:

So the hardest idea in Noah has always been for me that God decided to kill everyone in the first place. 

 

Well not everyone.  Certainly most everyone.

 

This is reflected in two of Noah's dreams/visions.  In the first he finds himself underwater with floating dead bodies everywhere.  In the second he is in one of Tubal-Cain's cities looking for future wives for Ham and Japheth (and possibly Shem since Ila is still barren at this point).

 

Noah's experience is not a happy or comfortable one and as he is standing surveying the rampant evil he has a vision of fire falling from heaven and obliterating the city.

 

It is about then that Noah is convinced that humanity is the problem that needs to be corrected.  The animals are fine as they are.

 

But nowhere does God explicitly say that he intends to wipe-out humanity.  Of course it is not made explicit that Noah and family are the seeds of a replanting of the human race.

 

Birthstone wrote:

Does God change Gods mind, or is it assumed that God has that right?

 

It is presumed that God has the right although there is disagreement between Noah and the rest of the family that they are to die out naturally after the flood.  The rest of the family seeks to fulfil the mandate of creation to be fruitful and multiply.  Noah will have none of that program.

 

Birthstone wrote:

Or is the movie shown from God's perspective at all,or just the people deciding it must be God?

 

The visions are definitely from God and they only communicate the bare minimum necessary.  There will be a flood, everyone will drown, animals will be saved in an arc.  Apart from that folk are filling in gaps based on how they interpret the world around them.

 

Noah, seeing the sin of humanity and noting that it is only humanity to be completely drowned in the flood arrives at the conclusion that humanity is creation's greatest problem.

 

The rest of the family, represented by Naamah, advocate for a merciful God who does not desire to wipe out a whole race.

 

In the end, Naamah's opinion wins out and humanity participates in the repopulation of the planet.

 

While Noah is obviously the hero of the story and it is Noah alone who receives the visions and, for the most part, calls the shots.  Noah is a flawed character.  He makes mistakes in dealing with others (Ham especially) and when he is driven those flaws are frightful.

 

He understands it is his responsibility to do whatever God commands.  He doesn't seem to think very much or very often about grace or mercy.  Certainly not for humans.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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revjohn wrote:
But nowhere does God explicitly say that he intends to wipe-out humanity.  Of course it is not made explicit that Noah and family are the seeds of a replanting of the human race.

 

yeah, a little genocide is better than a wholesale genocide ;3

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InannaWhimsey

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Birthstone wrote:
Good to see your review John.  For the record (as a PK) I hated Touched by an Angel, Highway to Heaven and Seventh Heaven too- ick!!  I didn't say it often because it seemed like everyone else in the entire world liked them, but maybe it was too much saturation for me.

So the hardest idea in Noah has always been for me that God decided to kill everyone in the first place.  Does God change Gods mind, or is it assumed that God has that right?  Or is the movie shown from God's perspective at all,or just the people deciding it must be God?   Curious - could make or break it for me.

 

 

I notice the person who did the movie is darren aronofsky, who did one of my favourite quirky movies (and would be perfect for the WC crowd methinks) called Pi, essentially aboot a guy who comes across the 'secret of universe' and then becomes besieged by other groups who have their own version of the secret of universe...

 

(his The Fountain is also a cool trippy love story...)

 

But anyhew, the story of Noah is another in the 'g_d, genocidal maniac' (or scientist trying to deal with an experiment that got out of hand...) tales...

 

But then, if a Christian were to take it as metaphor...

 

Also, there are many, many g_ds in the bibble...the Noah narrative is taken from a  *much* earlier time than the g_d of the New Testament...what culture was Noah a part of?  so which g_d might he have worshipped and, therefore, be dealing with?

 

And then, we know we live in a reality where, see that lionness over there, in order to feed her cubs, she has to kill that wildebeest alive over there.  So which is more cruel?  Her letting her cubs starve or her killing that wildebeest, born from a mother, who maybe has family, etc.

 

 

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revjohn

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Hi InannaWhimsey,

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

yeah, a little genocide is better than a wholesale genocide ;3

 

That's the principle behind chemotherapy isn't it?

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

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InannaWhimsey

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revjohn wrote:

Hi InannaWhimsey,

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

yeah, a little genocide is better than a wholesale genocide ;3

 

That's the principle behind chemotherapy isn't it?

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

*chuckle* So now humanity is cancer...nice ;3

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revjohn

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Hi InannaWhimsey,

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

*chuckle* So now humanity is cancer...nice ;3

 

That, in this telling of the movie, is Noah's conclusion.

 

I expect that Noah makes the classic causation/correlation mistake.

 

It isn't humanity that is the cancer it is humanity that is infected with it.

 

The movie depicts a very clear difference between the sons of Seth (Adam and his kin) as well as the sons of Cain (Tubal-Cain and his kin)

 

Ham has the potential to go bad is that because Naamah is the sister of Tubal-Cain and so carries within her the influence of Cain?  Or, is the fact that Naamah is mentioned as the sister of Tubal in Genesis just a coincidence?  Chronologically speaking Tubal-Cain shouldn't be bumping into Noah as he does.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

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InannaWhimsey

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revjohn wrote:

Hi InannaWhimsey,

 

InannaWhimsey wrote:

*chuckle* So now humanity is cancer...nice ;3

 

That, in this telling of the movie, is Noah's conclusion.

 

I expect that Noah makes the classic causation/correlation mistake.

 

It isn't humanity that is the cancer it is humanity that is infected with it.

 

The movie depicts a very clear difference between the sons of Seth (Adam and his kin) as well as the sons of Cain (Tubal-Cain and his kin)

 

Ham has the potential to go bad is that because Naamah is the sister of Tubal-Cain and so carries within her the influence of Cain?  Or, is the fact that Naamah is mentioned as the sister of Tubal in Genesis just a coincidence?  Chronologically speaking Tubal-Cain shouldn't be bumping into Noah as he does.

 

Grace and peace to you.

John

 

Yeah, I like how these myths get told and retold and retold...

 

With all that entails.  We're a curious, creative species that cannot be stopped.  Blessed be.

 

I think I'm gonna see it with my sweetie at the cheap theatres after easter...absorb the essence of the movie so I can see more what the narrative threads of the movie 'are'...

 

See video

 

ps. oh, i heard aboot an ironic thing, that apparently a disclaimer has been added to the Noah movie:

 

"The film is inspired by the story of Noah. While artistic license has been taken, we believe that this film is true to the essence, values, and integrity of a story that is a cornerstone of faith for millions of people worldwide. The biblical story of Noah can be found in the book of Genesis."

 

I guess if it helps more people get over their various anxietites...

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Dcn. Jae

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http://drbrianmattson.com/journal/2014/3/31/sympathy-for-the-devil

 

Dr. Brian Mattson, Senior Scholar of Public Theology for the Center of Cultural Leadership, suggests the story presented in the "Noah" movie is based upon Gnosticism.

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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Dcn. Jae wrote:
http://drbrianmattson.com/journal/2014/3/31/sympathy-for-the-devil

 

Dr. Brian Mattson, Senior Scholar of Public Theology for the Center of Cultural Leadership, suggests the story presented in the "Noah" movie is based upon Gnosticism.

 

oh, thank Berners-Lee for that website; kudos to him for concentrating on text instead of the bells and whistles of fancy fonts, images, videos, music, etc.  nice and clean website.  easy on the eyes.  though, of course, i loves me a fancy wing-dingy website that rapes my mind with its extravagance...

 

(his videos are very sexxy and modern tho...)

 

(i think it is ironic how Brian seems to be upset at the type of g_dlike genocide in the film, that it isn't his type of accepted g_dlike genocide...but then, one cannot live life and believe anything without being ironic, paradoxical...)

 

 

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InannaWhimsey

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just came across this

 

 

 

(source: facebook)

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Serena

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The only part of the movie that I didn;t like is when Noah was going to murder his grandaughters.  That made him look like an insane old man.

 

 

I thought the part where he was separated from his wife and drinking so much was funny but sadly true.  Here they were all saved from the flood but Noahs marriage doesn;t survive the flood and what to men do when left to their own devices they get very drunk.

Not a bad movie but certainly extrabiblical.

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