Something that's really liberating to give up is television.

It's a good way to put a whole lot of personal time back in your life and eliminate a lot of aggravation. It's a step back from the NOISE and into family and social life.

This is off topic - but can anyone tell me how to upload images here?  My cousin has a beautiful photo of a winter river on her facebook page, I would love to share - but I can't seem to get it to work.  Any suggestions? (I tried copying it to Flickr and entering the URL in the above "image" box, but it still doesn't upload).

If it's sized down to fit here, you can just click and drag an image from any other site into the Wondercafe comment box.

I load them to my Facebook page then click and drag — then sometimes delete them from Facebook.

Here is a link to that article that I mentioned in Harper's Magazine on fasting ...

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B3AwuGVak_HSQ3BKSGIyQjlzTmM/edit?usp=sha...

Day 4: Saturday - In the Presence 

Whoops - it's kinda large.  Oh well - at least it worked anyways.  Thanks, Mike.

I don't think I'd want to immerse myself in this winter river, but I'm imagining sitting on the bank with a thermos of hot tea..........

I love listening to the river near me (the Salmon River in Ontario). Every day it is different. I listen and listen and I hear it become articulate — "angel song" — and I draw a lot of peace from that.

THANKS for sharing the photo!

Day 4: Saturday - In the Presence 

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I know, I too have had tears come at particular experiences of god's presence but also laughter, in fact my whole emotional repertoire palys with experience of god… off to think.

Interesting article, qwerty.  I've done a fair bit of reading about the benefits of the raw foods diet and juice cleansing, etc.  But not much reading about just straight fasting.  I'm still trying to sort out what might be a healthy diet for someone with chronic fatigue - the main struggle is changing bad habits and dealing with cravings & comfort eating.  So I have decided to take a step back and research creative ways to let go of emotional eating patterns first.

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I'm still pondering todays' Lent topic - I do find it easier to experience a sense of God's presence when I'm in nature.  

I'll comment more later..............

I think when Gabriel said "I stand in the presence of God", that Gabriel meant that that is where he exists - as an angel, that is where he is, where he lives.

While I'm not an angel, I feel that, very simply, that is my response to this question.  Because of how I see God, and how I see myself, I am always in the presence of God.  I am where God is, and God is where I am.  So, I do everything in the presence of God.

But I get a sense that this question is referring to a more "emotional" experience, when one feels they are "more" in the presence or God . . . or rather, more experiencing God - which I think has more to do with the individual than God (again, as God is always there.)

I've had a few of these "emotional" experiences when I have felt God's presence in a different way, such as mentioned by the author - on a quiet summer morning, when all is still, when the birds begin to sing, when the sun rises in its glory, etc. etc.  Such experiences as these touch me in a different way, and make me more aware of the beauty of the earth around me, created by God.  But I tend to be more of a type of person who just lives, mostly in the ordinary, believing God is there.

Listen mostly.

When God is so close that the presence is palpable I expect that there is a reason for that and most often a reason that I am initially unaware of.  So I listen and wait for God to reveal what that reason might be.

I decided yesterday afternoon that I would take up the practice of fasting, at least for the season of Lent.  I have also decided that I will fast on Saturdays because they are the Sabbath and the purpose of the Sabbath rest was to draw nearer to God.  So, I intend to use the Sabbath and the practice of fasting, in tandem.

That way the last fast breaking will be Easter Sunday morning celebrating Holy Communion at the Sunrise Service.

Grace and peace to you.

John

In the presence of god, what do I do? I live. I sleep and wake, eat, drink, do stuff, use the loo, take a shower, go walking, sit writing… between breaths, and with breaths, I try to express gratitude.  I also imagine, think, interact… engage.

What do I do when I’m NOT in the presence of god? I can’t remember.  What did I do before I was aware of always being in god’s presence? I had fun (like Augustine). I still have fun, but it’s better, more fulfilling …a richer mix of beauty and abundance.

What I don’t quite “get” in today’s question is the implicit idea that we can somehow experience god’s presence one day, with all of its bedrock-shattering transformation of the spirit and then, the next day, step aside from that experience and decide to keep the morning clear for other things and not be in god’s presence until, say, after lunch. Can people really do that? Why would anyone want to?

What do I do when I am in the presence of God?

Having been raised Anglican, one of the things that I miss is the actual getting down on my knees and praying to God.( I realize that this isn't always physically possible for everyone)

I can pray standing up, sitting down and when I'm walking, but nothing shifts a perspective for me as much as actually getting down on my knees. Suddenly I'm humbled and I am a servant. There are not too many places that I would feel comfortable on my knees in front of people outside of church but I have found I can do it quite easily when I'm in the garden. There I am surrounded by beauty and cushioned by the earths dirt and grasses and my senses are peaked to hear God speak. I am more open and relaxed and my guard is let down.

What do I do there? Sometimes I talk out loud, sing, listen or just be silent and sometimes I release my troubles and cry. I feel the same when I'm near any lake, river, or ocean. God must have known the beauty that he created would call us back to him .

Like the song says, "I don't know how, but there's power when I'm on my knees"

What do I do when I am in the presence of God? The short answer first.   I do what I am doing at the moment!  Sometimes I wash the dishes.  Sometimes I read magazines.  Sometimes I just sit and stare stupidly into space.  Sometimes I look into the mirror and make sure there isn’t any soap remaining behind my ears as I finish shaving in the morning.  God is there always (even if we aren't looking) just as in the deep ocean a tsunami is invisible while its power remains undiminished.

Life, otherwise known as, "Being in the presence of God", is something like listening to Beethoven’s 9^th Symphony.  It is a pretty big piece and it demands your attention.  Sometimes your attention wanders and maybe you start thinking about your mother or something and stop hearing the music.  The symphony is there in all its glory but you are not hearing it.  This is one way in which being in the presence of Beethoven is a lot like being in the presence of God.  The symphony is there but sometimes you are not paying attention or all that your mind wants to focus on is the coughing and nose blowing of the gathered throng.  In life (just as with Beethoven in the concert hall) God is not gone ... you are.

So, then, in life as at the concert hall, the trick is to bring your attention back. Learn not to focus on the irritating habits of the concertgoers.  When you do that you realize that, irritating though they may be, they (must) have their good points.  After all, just like you, they thought enough of Beethoven to come to the concert.  When you look at them this way you are more sympathetic.  Just like you, they are trying to hear the music but, just like you, too, they are coughing, or thinking about their mother, or wondering how the baby sitter is faring and they are hearing the symphony only in short snippets.  Realizing that, you like them better and with a little practice you can learn how it feels ... what your attitude is ... the way that you view things ... when you are present ... and then you can adopt this attitude to the world as a matter of policy.  Then, even in the moments of distraction and irritation, one can still love one's fellows better and be happier for it.

A final observation ... babies get such a big kick out of the game of "peek-a-boo" because they somehow imagine that when your face disappears behind your hands that you have really gone away.  When you take your hands away and they can once more see your face they are startled and begin to laugh because they are happy to see that you have come back.  Of course, you never really left.  Nevertheless, from the baby's point of view it is magic.  Sometimes if they are new to the game, they are so startled that they will cry real tears.

I'm having one of those "grey" days - feel kinda flat emotionally - sort of like that first picture taken today in front of the house.  It looks like black & white, but I didn't intend it that way.  Quite a contrast to the next photo, which is the same tree - taken last fall right after a rain shower.

I mention this because I notice in myself that my sense of God's presence tends to be closely related to my emotional & physical states.  I wish I felt closer to God today - but then I keep thinking of the words of my spiritual guidance mentor - that our faith shouldn't be based on feelings and that God is always present whether we feel him/her or not. 

True.  But that doesn't stop me from wanting the experience / feelings anyways.  Maybe that makes me rather "spiritually immature", but it seems pretty human, too.

I like the video / song  that you posted, waterfall.  I too, find that sometimes it helps to pray kneeling - if only just to get my unhealthy ego out of the way abit.

My brain is too foggy today to say much more.  I'm longing for spring and more colorful trees.  Maybe I'll go buy some bright colored yarn and play around with a crochet project.  Sometimes I get a glimpse of God presence through the meditative motions of crocheting.......

I have enjoyed scrolling down and listening in. A fine season for looking just a little deeper than might be our daily habit. In particular, this year, I am looking at my resort to language. How some years back, after about seven years wrestling with Martin Heigdegger's "On the Way to Language", I stepped out of the predominant syntax and began pressing the boundaries of meaning. Not just in thought, or speech, but in my effective actions as an employee of the United Church, a follower of the unstructured way given in the gospel of Jesus Christ; in the power of the Spirit.

On my own way to language, I have been well served by the diverse critical thinkers and caring persons who have walked in conversation with me in this place as in the courts of the Church.  

Gratitude and appreciation...!

There is nowhere I can go to find myself out of God's presence.  In much the same way there is no place I can go in my house that I am outside of my wife's presence.  There is always something about her very near to hand.  Even last month when she was physically in Hawaii there was still a sense of her in every room.

And yet, there is no denying that I can ignore that sense of presence at my pleasure.  If I want to watch a hockey game I can remove myself to the less popular television.  If I want to spice up my chili till it makes my eyes and nose run I can do that also.

It is when she wants to be near that my ability to ignore her presence runs the risk of incurring wrath.  Even as finite as it may be.

So I think that presence is nuanced. 

There is immanence, that sense of the very close and really near.  That there is something that can be touched or, may decide to do the touching.  And there is transcendant, which goes beyond the ordinary senses.

I expect that for the most part I sense God's transcendant presence.  The play of shadow on snow or the splash of colour in sunset or sunrise betray, to me, the fingerprints of God and anywhere that God's fingerprints can be found means that God has, at the very least, been near by.

My encounters with God's immanent presence are beyond my ability to control and quite beyond anything else I have experienced. 

Hello crazyheart, I noted your response when I lost wrote but I may have been hasty and hope I did not offend you. I just wonder how much we do think of what is used in church to remind us of God's direction in our lives or of the neverending love that is there for us. I pray that during this time of Lent we all try to come to a closer relationship with our Creatorand listen for the small still voice that calls us to a new life.

Hi Hamilton. I lost the thread the comments were on. I like the things that are used in church( the rituals, the visuals, the smells, the liturgy, the readings). All of these things remind me of God's direction in my life. I know I am a Child of God so I think God is with me all the time. I may be naive but this is my life as I see it.

I like the Seasons of the Spirit and Lent is the season that makes me contemplate what is happening in my life. Every year it is a new beginning for me as I hope it is for you. Blessings.

Hi Folks, in case you missed it, Week Two of the WonderCafe Lenten discussion is continuing here: 

http://www.wondercafe.ca/discussion/church-life/week-two-diving-deeply-lenten-discussion

Thanks!