Is, Was, and Ever Shall Be, world without end. Amen.

I get your point, & I agree that these questions are indeed practical & deserve a close look.

Bolt

hmmmmm

what happened to " is"

Bolt, I never mentioned about giving upon those you love. If I did state that would mind telling me where I made that statement so I can correct it. I would have to have a bolt loose to write that. lol

Thanks Bolt.

No Tom you didn't say that, but it's the impression I get when I explain to you How these scripture referances can be taken out of context.

You don't have to agree with me Tom, but I would like to know if what I'm saying to you is clear & understood.

We as God's children are commissioned to Love & minister to all people in what ever way is acceptable to them without comprimizing our convictions.

The message you covey with these scriptures is by no means an attractive form of witness.

The change or else method of message in ministry, is flawed.

This brings no one to a better understanding of the gospel of Christ.

Without understanding of the gospel, there is no  understanding the mind of Christ.

The scriptures themself are words of pure wisdom, but how scripture is presented deserves as much, if not more wisdom.

Bolt

Bolt, sorry I can't sugar coat the word, that is if I'm understanding you correctly. I do believe once I have given what I believe God's wisdom its up to the individual to do what they will with it. I know if Paul had written the word so it wouldn't rub my flesh the wrong way, I probably wouldn't have even bothered to read it. All I can say is, its up to you wither you want to read what I write or not.

Be blessed Bolt.

Tomlane

Tom, I love reading what you write.  I find it fascinating.

Bolt, you can have Tom on your team.  I insist.

We may be on the same team but we seem to have a problem getting our points accross.

Bolt 

Anybody can read Tom, well I gather most here can anyways.

You mention sugar coat the message.

I don't think you are understanding me.

For one who is enlightened & to have understanding of the message you proclaim, do you feel that all who hear this message of yours is ready to chew steak or are they not yet weaned off the teet?

You quote scripure liberally & this is great in it's place, & the message indeed holds it's own merit.

But if you think that understanding comes from bold use of scripture, it would seem as if you are using it as a weapon instead of a priciple.

The only time I see Jesus use scripture in that way is when He is fighting against satans temptation.

Think of who Jesus was dealing with at the time.  satan.  

I'm not saying  your motive is to battle us, but first impressions around here mean something & people in these part for the most part are not responcive to this type of witness.

Did not Paul speak of ministry within ones realm? He was a tent maker.

He preached to tent makers, among others & I highly doubt that the first focus of his ministry was the sins of all those in his presence.

I beleive his focus was the potential growth of the Kingdom of God.

No need to hold back & sugar coat anything when one preaches the good news, the Gospel of Christ.

Bolt

Chasen,  Thanks for the being the only cheerleader I have. Now they will be casting their innuendos at you now. lol

One has resumed drinking, another gives a complete biographical sketch, while yet another can't wait to tell me how rude I am and still another needs to show how witty he can be without scripture. All kinds Chasen, and all entertaining to say the least. Maybe one day one will come the full knowledge of Christ.

Chasen the best is yet to come. We haven't gotten into doctrine yet, but when we do then you'll we have to stay tuned. I'll go as easy on them as I can, cause I'm sure I'll really make the natives restless. I'll give you a hint as to what is coming. Imagine a title like: Is Water Baptism for Today" or "Is the Sunday Snack for the Church?" The Sunday snack being communion.

Tomlane

Thank you for your explanations Bolt, I am convinced since these days are so evil we should back up what we say with Scripture. I will agree when you said, that those that may be saved whoever they may be, are not weened of the teat as you stated. Also seems like they don't want to either.

I can only go by what the Holy Spirit gives me liberty to share on here. I'm no preacher or even close to one so if you are as spiritual as I think you are then you surely can read between the lines of what I give. Your comments wither you think I want to hear them or not are most welcome. I'm still learning as well.

Tomlane

Ah... but Tom... if you're learning, as well, why do you seem to be so sure that your interpretation of what the scriptures are saying is the correction one?

I mean - perhaps the Spirit is speaking to, and speaking through, me... or Witch, or chansen, too.

Christ's peace - r

Tom, I can't wait.  Let them cast their stones at us.  I don't care.

You're an evil, twisted man, Chansen... and I admire you greatly for it.

I suspect that's because if he allows you agree with him, then he will no longer be the "lone voice, crying in the wilderness", and therefor won't be quite as special.

8) *rotflmao*

God, I love the WonderCafe!

Christ's peace - r

RichardBott,

Did you see the advertisement for Wondercafe in the Observer? 

"Big questions.

Big discussions.

A little weird sometimes.

Wondercafe.ca"

So true. 

the longer this thread goes, the wierder it gets,P3. Also,Tomlane these are only stones. Duck when you see the boulders coming. Believe me, they are something to wait for.

Tom warned me these comments would come.  I will hide, as Jesus hid, and you will not cast your stones, or they will be ineffective, for I will be hidden.

John 8:59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

chansen

Don't worry. I will help you hide in the cleft of a rock.

The men in the white coats just arrived to take me away. I told them its all your fault. If you didn't fall in love with Tom none of this would have happened.

chansen  Tom

P.S. I hope you like cats. Tom has two. Do you have a scripture for them? By the way....where is Tom? What did you do to him? He told you : "Chansen the best is yet to come"....??

I'm 100% sure he's a man who keeps the word.

Thanks Chasen, we haven't seen anything yet, wait til we get into doctrine, you'll see the proverbial feathers fly then and the nasty remarks from small minds. I think some just like to come on here to vent their frustration on others. What do you think?

Tomlane

RichardBott, I secand that one. lol

Tomlane

Crazyheart, the bigger the boulders the more I'll be convinced God is giving me His truth.  The servant is not greater then the master so I do hope they caste their stones. Make me feel to home. lol

Tomlane

Yeah isn't it funny how the circle jerk works. Fundies need to be persecuted, because the Bible says that's how to tell a true Christian. Best way to be sure you get persecuted is to make sure people don't like you. Best way to make sure peope don't like you is to be as big a jerk to people as you can be.

So the fundies acts like a jerk, makes himself as unlikeable as possible, gets chastised for being a jerk, pretends it's persecution.... and voila.

"See how great a Christian I am? Look how I'm being persecuted!!!"

Somehow I don't think that's what Jesus was shooting for with that scripture.

Witch, thanks for the laugh, amazing how you put rediciules thoughts together to come up the idiotic statements you make.

Still laughing, Tomlane

P.S. still laughing.

Tom, you're absolutely right.  But remember Matthew 5:10: Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

We have to expect ridicule for our beliefs.  We, as Christians, expect ridicule/persecution and sometimes imprisonment and/or murder for the cause of Christ.  Jesus picks those He knows can complete the task for His cause.

p.s. I'm still laughing, too

So Chansen:

Still clinging to those strange ideas you have about the inerrancy of the Bible, I see.

Chansen, I certainly can't fault your logic. The Peanut gallery maybe brain dead spiritually, but I'm still laughing too. I can't but help but admire the tenacity can you? lol

Tomlane

Tom, chansen has experienced the tenacity of the folks of the WonderCafe in a varity of ways. What I really appreciate about him is that he keeps coming back with different ways of exploring his point.

There are times he frustrates the heck out of many of us... but he certainly calls us to think clearly about what we're saying.

Christ's peace - r

Richard, I haven't figured out yet where Chansen stands with the gospel, but at least he doesn't show dumb-wit tendencies. lol But I must admit they are funny and I think it must be catching. lol.

Just about every time I'm come on here and read the replies I spend more time laughing then I do writing. I think this is great site. And the  software to reply with is awesome. Sure can't complain about this site. Can't wait to read some more replies.

Tomlane 

Inappropriate laughter is just one more sign of mental illness

Witch, you are correct the laughter comes from inappropriate remarks.

I see you understand me as well as you understand the Bible... not at all.

Chansen - I've butted heads with you before, but I see now.  You have found someone who shares your views about Christianity and the Bible. 

Suffice to say it's still early in my relationship with God, but I find Tom's writings speak to me like few others.

chansen

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! .....!!!!!!!!!

Chansen, seeing how it does speak to you, that must make you a brother in Christ. Happy days because only those with a tender heart to the Lord hear his voice..

This something those that only criticize would be hard pressed to figure out and they take it as I'm boasting or better then they are.  Or they may think we think we have the only way. That would be erroneous because only God has the right way, thus voiding all other believes. Its either God's way or it won't work.

Tomlane

John 8:47  He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Tomlane

Richard, I would say that would be to eveyone's advantage that Chensen can challenge you all and maybe someone will start examining their own hearts in regard to God's truth.

Tomlane

Well you are included too Bolt. Sorry for the slip up. Discovering another brother is always exciting.

Tomlane

To help me, Tomlane, respectfully, can I ask what your views are on abortion, same sex marriage and Gun Control. This maybe should go in another thread but I am curious to know what you think about these issues. Everyone, if TomLane answers please respect what he has to say. Thanks.

It is a bit difficult to respect what he says when he often posts quotes but not his personal opinion and why he has it..

Tom wrote, "Richard, I would say that would be to eveyone's advantage that Chensen can challenge you all and maybe someone will start examining their own hearts in regard to God's truth."

Tom - I think you've got the right of it there.

Chansen, blackbelt, Witch, you, Aquaman, Crazyheart... actually, everyone who wanders into the WonderCafe, has something to teach me about God's truth.

The question for me sometimes becomes - "Hey, God? Am I supposed to be learning from our points of agreement, or our places of disagreement?"

Christ's peace - r

Tom. Chansen is an atheist and not what I would consider a brother in Christ.

Now that's not fair CF.

Just because Chansen doesn't agree with your opinions of twhat a true Christian is, doesn't make him an Atheist.

Granted, I think he's got some pretty far out notions about his state of Christianity, just as Tom does, but in the end, aren't you just falling into the same trap Tom has wallowed in? If you're not his kind of Christian, then you're not a Christian?

I think that Chansen had a very confused idea of what makes a Christian from talking back and forth with some of us on the Cafe.  No wonder he couldn't understand.  But then, along came Tom.  Somewhere in the back of his mind Chansen remembered the Bible verses he had memorized years ago, and after listening to Tom they began to make sense.  Tom is his spiritual big brother, leading him back to the right beliefs of a true Christian. 

Way to go, Tom!

Maybe Tom doesn't post on Sunday.

That might be true......if Chansen identified as a Christian. He doesn't, he has identified himself as an atheist. Unless I am totally missing something here.

Kaythecurler, the quotes from scripture I give are my personal opinions as I do believe that a believer in order to please God and Honor Christ has to conduct one's life as instructed by Christ. I also find the more I yield my members and life to God's instructions, the more joy and peace I have in my life. Also, I find I grow more spiritual and gain a deeper understanding of how wonderful the person of Jesus Christ is and the closer my relationship is to Him. I also believe since he bought my soul with His precious blood he is my master and I his servant and my service to him is my reasonable service. I also find Jesus Christ is not a spoiler of good things but rather is the giver of the best things in my life and his ways for me are never tiring or do the get old. I give scripture that I believe proves God's will and that to me is far more important than what anyone anywhere thinks or says about me. Its amazes me how so many on here think they have me figured out when they are not even close.

Romans 12:1  I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

Tomlane

I'm speechless.  Here I've been believing that God was the creator of all things - and here you are saying I've got it all wrong and it was really Jesus.

Maybe this is where you want everyone to start getting all tied up in knots defining which came first - Father, son or Holy Spirit?