When a UU search committee starts its work, one of the first things it is to do is establish with the church board what the financial and other terms of the position are to be. There is actually a formal process where a board member and a search member are appointed to handle negotiating the terms with the chosen candidate. Admittedly, we only do a formal search committee for ministry. Office manager is hired by the minister and board and janitorial services are contracted rather than hired (IIRC).

In your case, it sounds to me like some necessary communications between the Council and Search about the terms the church was prepared to offer did not happen at the right time. Search should have gone into the process with a clear notion of what the church had in its budget for each position. Then again, I'm speaking from UU experience and maybe UCCan practice is different.

Mendalla

I don't think a committee should on their own decide a position can be paid more. I would have expected that a salary range was set out by the Board after consultation with M&P. I also don't think a secretary position requires a search committee of members. Tat should be the job of the M&P committee I think

Recently we needed to hire a new minister of music on the retirement of the current one. A search committee was struck o they developed a job description and salary range and reported to the board

After some initial work they came back to the board and the stewards to say they were under priced and could they go higher. It was discussed by both boards before they had permission to go hirer.

The budget is important. If suddenly a position costs $10,000 the money has to come from somewhere

Out of curiosity, Mrs. Anteater, how long is the amalgamation taking?

Council directs the search committee. Always.

Interestingly, a UU search committee is not under the direction of the Board/Council, but reports directly to the congregation. IOW, it runs in parallel to the Board. That's why there has to be a formal process for liaison between the two.

I see merit in both the UU and United Church approaches myself.

Mendalla

Honestly, Crazyheart, we have been amalgamated for a year now- officially.

But....everything still seems to be such a mess. When I say we are still amalgamating , I mean, we are still working on becoming ONE- but it doesn't seem to happen.

When I first heard about the Council structure, I thought it would be a positive change from the Elder system. But basically, it ends up being the same,but using up more volunteers to fill committees. At the end, committees just  bring everything to council anyway and don't dare making decisions- it's really pointless and is exhausting the resources.

Lastpoint,

I was surprised when the committees were put together in the general meeting, but it was done. I don't think it was a huge amount that was asked for (definitively not $10000 more). I think, that the financial loss through members leaving or reducing their givings because of the consequences of that decision are far greater than the pay raise.  Our secretary was a very positive person and a great communicator. Since her leaving, another person  is filling in for her, who is rather the opposite, negative and hindering communication- in the situation we are in, communication is a key point in keeping the spirit up and things running. This is having a huge impact.

As well, the search committee volunteers are likely frustrated- other people are upset..

I think it is a matter of sharing and asking for something that will make things go further.  If we had said that we would like to give a payraise, but we need more funds- I believe we would have gotten it together.

I can see the frustration. However as a Syeward and member of our Board I also see the impact of groups overspending. "Just another $1000 " adds up when everyone thinks its ok to go over budget.

At our church we expect groups to budget and approach Stewards Nd the Board if they want to exceed it

Sounds like more was at play than salary.

The newest info I heard was that the committee had been given a salary range- and had stayed within it. So now the committee is frustrated and rightfully so.

Why should they volunteer if their suggestions are not respected. The real costs are even higher. People will not volunteer anymore on any committee.

That's a shame mrs.anteater - sounds like the council somehow over-ruled itself, if the committe was in fact within the given range.  In our church, our office admin is a treasure - and we try to make sure we're paying competitive wage so we can keep her.  I wonder if some churches 'cheap out' on such matters - and as you have pointed out, there are big consequences to such moves - sounds like everyone lost. 

Carolla,
So was our admin- she always had an encouraging word and loves to start the bulletin emails with a positive and/or funny intoduction.

The question you asked is "How much autonomy do committees have?" (re: hiring lay staff)

In United Church polity, the Board/Council/Unified Board is the legaly constituted court of the church empowered to hire/terminate lay employees.  (This ONLY applies to lay employees - the process is different for Ministry Personnel). To answer the question, a committee of a board does not have autonomy, and usually only has the authority to recommend a hire, and the board must make the formal decision. The Board could delegate that authority to a commission, but they would still be held accountable (The Manual 2013 B 7.5.2).

Unfortunately, it sounds in this case as though the search committee brought a recommendation that was within the parameters set by the Board, but the board did not accept the recommendation, which was essentially a gesture of non-confidence in the committee. That is the Board's right, but not wise in that it will make it more difficult for them to recruit committee members of any type.

Someone also mentioned that the M&P Committee should be delegated the responsibility of search and selection of staff. That is intentionally NOT one of the responsibilities of this committee (see The Manual 2013 B 7.8.5). If the M&P Committee hires, then they have a vested interest in the "rightness" of the choice they made, which may make it more difficult for them to fulfill their actual responsibilities objectively.

well explained - thanks BluesRiff.