Funny. There are a lot of people in my church who a) don't use Facebook (I asked in last spring); b) don't follow Twitter (and don't know about it); c) haven't got a clue what Livestream is; d) don't use Wondercafe; and e) don't know what the heck a Q-Code is and haven't got the mobile phone or the software to check it out.

Got any bones for us? Or is the United Church going to ignore (once again) a significant constituency? Why, why why do we do this to ourselves?

Print this and put it in our church bulletin? Nope. It would be very, very poor stewardship to run 200 copies for our church bulletin. And no, we don't do video in church because of severe technical and fiscal issues involved.

Got any bones for us?

Hi DKS,

No worries, news and updates from GC41 will continue to be shared and reported in all the traditional ways as well. 

Thanks,
Aaron

I'll be watching on Livestream as well as heading over to Carleton to hear a couple of the speakers.

Heh Aaron, thanks for this one.  Will pass it on.

We recognize that there are multipleways to get the message out at work, and so, I am  thankful that you are also approachng multiple ways. 

There is a significant portion of the audience who can and do use electronic items such as livestream and online following, so your time to do this one is much appreciated.

I also trust in the team's willingness and desire to service those who do not have success access.   

I wonder how we, as people who do have, can help those who don't?

One idea might be to print out some of those items, or offer to host a gathering for those who may be interested in watching opening or closing ceremonies?

It would be wonderful to think out solutions as a community with others.

From experience, I do not share your confidence. I also see no tools which enable effective communication with my constituency. The United Church continues its penchant for ignoring the foundational justice issues of accessibility, focussing on publicizing tools which are on the far side of the digital divide.

From experience, I do not share your confidence. I also see no tools which enable effective communication with my constituency. The United Church continues its penchant for ignoring the foundational justice issues of accessibility, focussing on publicizing tools which are on the far side of the digital divide.

DKS, I see you posted your response twice on this thread.  It really wasn't necessary, as I am sure that it has been posted at least a dozen times before in some format or another whenever any thought is usedto actually using something which isn't what you consider the ultimate way to communicate.  The only part that is missing is your reference to your history of internet communications " i was doing this long being you were born....."-type argument.

At some point, it would be lovely to see a compliment from you, or a suggestion which is constructive and helpful. 

So, what would be your suggestions? 

So, what would be your suggestions? 

I am posting from my IPad, and i am on the road using my iPhone as a wireless hotspot; a less than perfect device. It lacks a proper keyboard. Human fingers are very clumsey when using the IPad. Frankly, the technology interface leaves much to be desired.

And yes I have run the GC computer communications program, posting on line in 1990 and 1994. I did the first computer projection at an annual meeting and at General Council.

I want and need helpful, useful tools for effective communication in my ministry context. The church hasn't said what will be used. Just a bunch of broadband-exclusive tools. I insist on better, for those without broadband access. That's a justice issue.

A text-based, non-HTML source which can be easily manipulated into a variety of contexts; a low impact, non-broadband stream which is accessible to all; a push-type broadcast methodology (not Twitter which is push on steroids and crippled). None of which have yet to be mentioned.

Having been to GC and to conference and now gaining some experience in broadcasting, I completely fail to see the necessity of any live cast. As one of my supervising producers said, "church stuff is a snore fest" And he is an active church member himself and has strived to make religious broadcasting interesting.

Hi DKS,

Amen.

Sometimes, even being present and an active part of the ongoings doesn't impart any excitivity.

As a Commissioner to GC-40 there was a lot of information passed around.  Most of my activity was mental.  I can't imagine anybody wanting to watch me sit at a table for an hour or so thinking and hoping to be entertained by it.

Sure, I can be animated and I cringe well at cringeworthy comments from the floor.  Still, exciting it isn't.

And how exciting is it to vote for moderator?  Mark your ballet, pass it to a steward, wait for the results.  The only thing threatened by edge of your seat material such as that is watching paint dry.

Which is not to say that Church meetings should not happen or even reported on.  Live stream just doesn't make much sense.  Save possibly for the worship events, then liturgy junkies could get their fill.

Grace and peace to you.

John

I agree, John. And not even for liturgy. Some of the stuff I have experienced at GC would be given a FAIL in any first course in worship. I recall the communion prayer which was strong on creation but made no mention of God, Jesus or the Holy Spirit, leading me to wonder what exactly I was remembering in communion.

Then there was the 1994 liturgy based on the rape of Susanna which did so much emotional damage to commissioners that the leaders formally apologized to the court. Severe emotional harm was done, requiring a strong pastoral effort.

Hi DKS,

Possibly.  Everybody was trained somewhere though so maybe a fail isn't a given.

I've heard similar stuff.

Well before my time and something I had not heard before.  That liturgy should probably be required reading for all seminarians as a case study on how not to write a liturgy.  Imagine if that had been live-streamed.

Grace and peace to you.

John

DKS -- some day, you will find a reason to smile upon the world.  In the meantime, maybe you can limit the amount of negativity you spread?

*****************************************************

I have experienced worship that was moving and exquisitely done at both presbytery, conference and at GC.   It is a gift to experience these services and I feel it is something worthy of sharing.  Thank-you Aaron.

*************************************

Secondly, it is good to be able to check in and see how people discuss and dialogue, the flow of GC.  For some, it is their first experience of the wider church, and they will see that GC is compromised of people just like them.

*************

Finally, for people interested in the dialogues on the crest, they can hear the arguments for & against or providing alternatives and the varied quality of arguments, but no lack of passion presented

I smile and laugh frequently. I could not live without laughter. But I find little joy and far, far too much earnestness, correctness and demand for "right thinking" (including the belief that I will,one day, be educated correctly) in the courts of the church today.

hah, i realized I typed compromised instead of comprised. too funny. 

bah, dks, if you laugh frequently and smile often, you seem to rarely bring it to the site. 

How about sharing some of the highlights of GC that you have seen in the past.  Something that gave you joy?  

I am going to share these inserts tomorrow at church. Most of the people in our congregation can access most of the technological stuff. Someone might even watch part of the livestream. Or not. It is nice on some level that there is that option. The people who do not have access to technology in our congregation are very capable of getting the information another way. I am a commissioner, so can share what I can when I can.

Not much. It was generally hot, little AC, mystery meat sandwiches and people arguing. The "reveal" of Nora Sanders was interesting. GC also killed any excitement I might have had for Voices United. Still can't sing a lot of it. Then there was the riot outside one night by church conservatives.

Not much. It was generally hot, little AC, mystery meat sandwiches and people arguing. The "reveal" of Nora Sanders was interesting. GC also killed any excitement I might have had for Voices United. Still can't sing a lot of it. Then there was the riot outside one night by church conservatives.

It would be helpful if we knew those other ways, not just the techno weenie ways.

Well DKS, how about helping sharing those alternative ways in plain English instead of just slamming the techno weenie ways.

I do not get the argument that if something is not useful for you than it can not be used by others.

it's a binary mind, Alex

Northwind, can I recommend a blog -- even if you only post a few paragraphs, it will give people a flavour of the cofnerence from someone they know.  You could start with it now, about the reading & prep.

ps. i did a blog and people who didn't do the other stuff did read & commend

How to share?

Ask church secretaries to be put on mailing lists, 

Ask one person in your church to be the communicator -- the Presbytery rep would bea good person.  

Have the communicator gives updates before , after & during conference.

Print summaries out for people to read at church.

As the church secretary to subscribe to one of the lists and, forward it to church members.

Have a luncheon at church and talk about conference mid-week.  Pray for delegates

*******************

hmm, that took about two minutes, who has other ideas?  

I did. a Listserv sends a  text based document sent in bulk to a bunch of e-mail addresses. It's efficient and simple to get for those on dial-up internet (still a good portion of those on the internet in Canada) and works well with cell phones and their rapacious data rates.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/2012/05/21/dialup-internet-canada.html

I did not say that. I am arguing for more broad access technologies rather than the narrow list which has been presented. I'm still waiting for the bone.

All of those are a given, and ends in themselves. I have been doing all of them since 1988. I am arging for upstream content, which we have not been assured will be provided. We have just heard of high bandwidth and mobile end results. I insist on better.

I live in Northern BC, a relatively remote part of the country by most's standards. Yes, many people  here are on dial up or poor/expensive satellite.  Those who would not be able to access FB and the like, are probably not on the Internet at all. Our congregation  compensates for this by making sure there are print versions of important information.

Thanks for the blog idea Pinga. I have started writing a blog anyway, and sometimes church things enter into it. Perhaps if I do write about GC41, I will also find another way to prepare. You know, in the spirit of learning what you teach......

Thanks DKS. I still may not be sure what you are hoping for, but did you know you can sign up for the RSS feed of the GC41 news page and have every update sent directly to your email inbox. Would that help? See the bottom left corner of this page: http://www.gc41.ca/news

Also, at GC40, the live video stream was one of the most popular tools for following the council, and constantly used at capacity, so there are some who find it helpful.

Heh Aaron

It may be that what is missing is the communication of what the various feeds are, from a customer service standpoint

ie

For those who want a simple email, with words only due to poorer internet capabilities or other reasons, then, you will wish to use our """"""""""".  Click here to enter your email address to get simple instructions sent to you (or send an email to )

Heh Aaron

It may be that what is missing is the communication of what the various feeds are, from a customer service standpoint

ie

For those who want a simple email, with words only due to poorer internet capabilities or other reasons, then, you will wish to use our """"""""""".  Click here to enter your email address to get simple instructions sent to you (or send an email to )

Nope. That's an RSS feed into a browser. I'm looking for plain text e-mail feed for the broadband impaired.

I never said it wasn't helpful to some. It is completely useless to many, however.

I will, for example, be at a cottage during GC with dialup internet or I can choose to blow my bandwidth cap by using my cellphone. An appropriate alternative for presenting the GC information would be appreciated.

As I said earlier, the United Church, in its rush to embrace technology, fails those who are not only behind the curve, but are totally outside the circle. As I said earlier and I will continue to say, "So much for our profession of inclusiveness".

All are great ideas. One thing I did in 1988 was to used a TAD (Telephone Answering Device) to record a summary of GC news and people can call in to receive the information. I updated it daily. It was well received.

That is exactly what I have been trying to say, apparently unsuccessfully. I have been saying this for the last few GCs.

DKS -- inbound text is cheaper than phone rates in many cases.  When I am travelling I can get unlimited text inbound on a cell phone for $5 / month.  It comes me a $1.50 a minute to call in. 

Depends. I have unlimited local and long distance calling in North America in my home phone (wired) phone plan. I have 100 minuted of Canada-wide long distance on my cell phone plan. Using a TAD works best with local calls and calling areas, although in 1988 we knew that there were long distance calls being made (it was often at night, back in the days of 60% discount after 11 PM). My own local calling area is huge, compared to Toronto, for example.

I said "in many cases"

And, as I said, It "depends" on a number of variable factors.

Any 'distribution' of a 'plain text document' --of what, I guess is another puzzle-- would depend on a reliable, updated and maintained list of email addresses for all members of the United Church.

That list does not exist, nor will it ever based on the organizational structure of the church.

The work of the Commissioners is to share the information from GC41 with their congregations...the General Council Office can ONLY do what CAN be done, which is to provide the live, real time inormation as widely as possible with the hope that the various courts of the church will in good faith pick it up and communicate that to everyone that is interested.

There is no bone. There is only work and research and frustrations with technology, and it's limitations.

Is there a problem with using RSS to email bridges?

Here is a list of seberal RSS to email bridges, and as well,some RSS to sms bridges.
http://blog.themeforest.net/resources/7-rss-to-emailsms-services-you-can...

That is nonsense.  Use a listserv. It simply requires that users subscribe to a listserv. The list can be configured to remove any subscriber returning a bounce message after 12 or 24 hours or whatever way the list is set.

This is technology which can be used and is completely appropriate to be used. IT will likely tell you it's not possible, which is a complete pile of stinking, steaming manure.

This is simple, elegant technology. Wood Lake Books, for example, has been using listservs for nearly tweny years with very, very few problems. It's not rocket science.

DKS.  THe idea of GC personnel trying to compile a list of addresses and send stuff to them is ridiculous, particularly during GC itself.  But something where folk can subscribe (andf take responsibility for getting the info) is right in line with what is being offered in the broadband category

DKS -- i still get my old stuff from the listserver, but never read it.

old technology, not interested in....boring text.

sadly, the fact that they continue to use it is a sign of how outdated some of our methods have become.