Shaking my head

I actually hope they come, in a way. When they get here, they will find out that we have anti-hate speech laws. Maybe some time in jail will do her some good.

She is a disgusting blight upon the face of humanity.

I agree, Rev.

Some of the Reverend's kin and ilk are coming to Toronto tonight to protest a play being held downtown, one that (humorously, apparently) exposes him for who he is.

Many of my friends are going to protest the protest, as it were, and I'm really not sure if I want to. Some say it gives them more publicity, others say that at the very least we should match their numbers as a show of solidarity with the performers, paying audience and, well, pretty much everyone to the left of his extreme right, which includes a fair number of right-wing people!

Apparently seven of his minions are on their way (and I hope the border laughs them back southbound but they're a savvy crew) so I could take the easy way out and say "oh, enough people will go to match their numbers" but that doesn't sit well with me at all.

Any thoughts, here?

Unbelievable. They shouldn't even be allowed across the border given their stated mandate. Or have them spend some time as guests of the Canadian correction system after spewing their hatred. Someone with some clout publicly needs to step up and renounce their bullsh*t.

This woman and the rest of her "family" are an abomination. To say that anyone deserves to be killed, let alone in such a gruesome manner, is totally appalling. Every time one of them opens their mouth, they just get more and more repugnant.

Nothing the Westboro Family Circus does suprises me anymore.

I thought last summer they were nailed with a huge fine that would bankrupt them? How are they funding this? ICK

What dismayed me is the way the newsreport pushed it. When DEAR GOD will Westboro stop being referred to as a CHURCH as if we're all the same, and someone instead start reporting "Small, extremeist group of religious nutcase bozos shows us once again how disgusting they are, and all the proper faith organizations in North America condemn their actions"

Greetings,

waterfall asked "How revolting is this"?

VERY!!!

I found the reading I did on this group once I read waterfall's thread post very upsetting, and thought "how could people use God in this way"? I guess we all do that to a certain extent . . . use God, or our understanding of God, to support our own thoughts, opinions, judgements on others, etc. etc.

I guess there are and will always be people who shock, upset, offend, demean, hate, and act in unbecoming ways in the name of God (or their understanding of God).

I sure hope those in my life (and my fellow Wondercafers) let me know if I appear to be going off the deep end . . .

Hope, peace, joy, love,
Beloved

They are not a church but a cult. I can't imagine people thinking like this today. Where did they go to school?
It is sad and I hope for the sake of the McLean family they fail to arrive.

They were going to protest and call the Amish girls killed in that school shooting whores and that they deserved to burn in hell until radio host Mike Gallagher gave them air time to stop them. Gallagher did it again when they were going to protest at Virginia Tech. That is just an example of how whacked they are.

Tsakani brought up something that is interesting. He asked "Where did they go to school?"

Fred Phelps, founder, went to Bob Jones. He left there after a few semesters. He went to a few bible schools and then in 1951 got a degree from a community college in California. He got a 1962 law degree from Washburn in Kansas. He was active in civil rights and got some NAACP awards and all that was NOT prior to his Westboro days. He was disbarred in 1979. But Westboro has existed since 1955...

He has 13 children. Eight are daughters, which adds to the many names in the sect, though it is mostly family.

Fred Phelps Jr. is a lawyer and worked for Kansas Dept of Corrections. His wife is a lawyer and runs a day care (yep)

Margie is a lawyer and was/is active with Kansas Dept of Corrections.

Rachel is a lawyer.

Abigail is a lawyer (Youth and Adult Services, Juvenile Offender Program)

Jonathon is a lawyer.

Rebekah is a lawyer.

Elizabeth is a lawyer at Phelps Chartered and was staff at Sheltered Living, Inc. and former counsel for the Shawnee County Sheriff's Department.

Timothy is a lawyer and was/is with Shawnee County Department of Corrections; . His wife is also an attorney employed by the same.

Shirley Phelps-Roper earned a B.A. in Criminal Justice and J.D. degree from Washburn University. Her and her husband, also a lawyer, have 11 children. Only one of her children are estranged from the church I think.

Mark and Nate are estranged from the family and not active in WBC

Katherine was a lawyer and was disbarred and is now no longer active with WBC.

Dorotha is a lawyer but no longer active in WBC.

Good news. They are going to be shut out at the border:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/manitoba/story/2008/08/08/westboro-protest.html

Happy dance! There was some nasty comment by one of them about Guards having to strip search them to find teh WBC tattoo on their butts. Maybe we should have UCC tattoos? lol

I'd like to see an invitation to the local community to come help defend the border :)

The added bonus, is that it means that if they sneak through some how, the local cops can arrest them instantly, so even if they make it, their damage will be limited.

Greetings!

I looked up the web-site that Rev. Matt posted and read the article re: border crossing. It talked about a Facebook networking site that said . . . "More than 500 people have since joined the group; postings indicate they plan to form a "human wall" around the family to shield them from the church protest, if it takes place." This statement and the possible sight of a caring human shield protecting this family in their time of pain and sadness is touching.

Hope, peace, joy, love,
Beloved

*Joins Birthstone in the Happy Dance*

I am extremely glad to see the federal government speak out against WBC. I actually mentally applauded Stockwell Day - who'd a thunk I'd ever do that? - when he referred to them as lunatics.

Last reports I saw said the Facebook group was up to over 700 people. I agree with Beloved - it is heartening to see the support and caring for the family. A human shield of protection around the family would be wonderful.

and Shirley Phelps-... - she is worried that she may have to call her people back, since the government up here appear to be "Crazy"

I know Harper is bad, but geesh!

*heart breaking* what terrible things to say :( evil personified.

Fred Phelps is the bottom of the barrel of Christianity He basis his faith on hate as attested, on the internet, but some of his children who have separated themselves from him. He, and some of his offspring, are or have been lawyers. It's amazing how people who are above average intelligence can remain so emotionally immature and spiritually dead. Religion is one way to run away from God and a good place to hide from yourself. It seems Phelps and his crew have this down to an art. Canada should permanently bar Phelps and his group from Canada. He needs to keep his poison south of the border. Perhaps the United States should banish him to an ice flow in the Antarctic. He could teach the penguins to hate.

as revolting as this is the very little good that is seen is that the counter protests are often very strong and effective. The 'human wall' method has and is often employed to counter WBC.

Also as an aside if anyone ever gets the chance to see a play called "The Laramie Project" I strongly recommend it. I am pretty sure that is the play that some of the WBC members were in Toronto to protest. The play is not about WBC or Fred Phelps but he is involved. I should not say any more or I may spoil it.

Peace

Joel

Shoot 'em at the border!

Revolting as it gets!

Connect the dots indeed. Though she is more inline with the word of the bible.

And to show that just when you think no more insult could be added to this family there was an article in the Globe and Mail about how someone scammed a Facebook group that was created to support the family...

Phony sister scams donations
SUNNY DHILLON , with a report from The Canadian Press

August 20, 2008

VANCOUVER -- When Ron Schinners of Vancouver heard the grisly details of Tim McLean's final moments aboard a Greyhound bus near Portage la Prairie, Man., last month, Mr. Schinners - whose brother-in-law was slain in 2003 - felt he had to do something.

To show his support for the family, Mr. Schinners, of Port Alberni, B.C., launched a Facebook group, whose membership quickly jumped to several hundred as outrage over the incident spanned the globe. One of those members sent a message to Mr. Schinners last week, claiming to be Amanda McLean, Tim's eldest sister.

She wasn't, much to Mr. Schinners's eventual surprise.

"I got suckered and I feel stupid about it," he said.

As a show of respect, he handed administrator duties over to the fake Ms. McLean. She immediately set up a PayPal account to collect donations said to be for the family.

Last Thursday, Mr. McLean's real sister - Amanda Corrigan - joined the group and announced that the woman collecting donations was orchestrating a sick fraud.

Donations to Tim McLean's family can be made at any TD Canada Trust bank.

The ability of my fellow man to sink to such depths never ceases to confound me.

Hello wasterfall....God bless you.....

oh waterfall....my Holy Spirit is sad...
Hatred is so aweful.....

IJL:bg

"Shoot 'em at the border!"

I agree, stop 'em like alberta stopped the rats!! (A fitting metaphor IMO).

You know, I think the intent to enter a country to cause harm (be it emotional, or physical), through use of threats, fear, or such, is an act of terrorism...

I think they should "Conviently disappear" and show up in a CSIS interrogation bay about 16 or 17 years later....:)

But seriously...this is disguasting, If I could meet those people i'd give them a peice of my (and many other's) mind(s).

*sigh*

Allah help us all!
As Salaam Alaiykum
-Omni

I find it so depressing that those who apparently follow Christ are pointing fingers at the lost rather than leading them to Christ. All sins are equal in Gods eyes. If Tim desered a death like that we all do. The God I know is a forgiving God. It is a shame that the church does not believe it.

I find it so depressing that those who apparently follow Christ are pointing fingers at the lost rather than leading them to Christ. All sins are equal in Gods eyes. If Tim desered a death like that we all do. The God I know is a forgiving God. It is a shame that the church does not believe it.

Ya know there are 969 comments on this link?  Even fundamentalists agree this family's full of whack-jobs.

what i find truy filthy and disgusting is her way of talk. don't talk to others in such a way of disrespect. that is filthy

The Omnissiah said it best "stop 'em like alberta stopped the rats!! (A fitting metaphor IMO)."

The followers of this church sadden and sicken me.

Peace

"Here's what I know. He is dead and God does not do that to people that serve in his truth."
 

I guess she's never read the bible... From John the Baptist to Paul, to the thousands of martyrs in the Roman Empire, people often are killed for God.

Go ahead and try to debate Shirley or Fred on the bible.  They know it inside and out.  Yes, they focus on some bits and ignore others, but if you want to extract a coherent message from it, some picking and choosing is required.

Point being, they have biblical authority to say what they do.  It's morally reprehensible, but then, so is much of the bible.

Here is an interesting little documentary about their church:

Phelps message is reprehensible, but it only differs from most fundie Christian sects in it's intensity. The attitude toward people's sexuality is essentially identical

I don't know how you can take the man seriously enough to get riled.  He is clearly as crazy as a shithouse rat and deserves pity more than anything.  No one except the usual suspects takes this man or his "church" seriously.

I think that there is another agenda in here somewhere but I can't figure it out.  Is there money in this for him? When he orchestrates "demonstrations" at which he never shows up, what is the payoff for him?  I went to a demonstration when he was supposed to appear at the Supreme Court of Canada some years ago, but he never showed.  Either he got stopped at the border, or this is just a tactic.  In any case, I won't be suckered by him again.

Tell that to the parents of the soldiers whose funerals are picketed.

And as Witch stated, their views are not that far from "mainstream" Baptist views.  They just turn up the volume and are more in-your-face about them.

so, they're at it again.  this time elizabeth edwards' funeral.  i'm all for freedom of expression (good and yes, bad too), i just wish the press would stop giving them recognition.

so, the government is trying to stifle their right to picket at the nine year old shooting victims funeral.  what do you think?  is this law an infringement on their rights?  it isn't really saying they can't protest, it's just prohibiting them from doing so at or near funerals.

PHOENIX - Arizona legislators planned to consider emergency legislation Tuesday to head off picketing by a fundamentalist church at the funeral service for a 9-year-old girl who was among six people killed during Saturday's shooting in Tucson.

The proposed law would prohibit protests at or near funeral sites.

It would take effect immediately if passed by the Legislature and signed into law by Gov. Jan Brewer.

Legislative aides said the bill appeared to be on track for quick passage, and Brewer spokesman Paul Senseman said the Republican governor would sign the bill if it reaches her desk.

The Westboro Baptist Church said Monday it plans to picket Thursday's funeral for Christina Taylor Green because "God sent the shooter to deal with idolatrous America."

The fundamentalist church has picketed many military funerals to draw attention to its view that the deaths are God's punishment for the nation's tolerance of homosexuality.

Lawmakers denounced the church's plan to picket the funeral of a child.

"This is just horrific that ... people have to deal with this. We shouldn't have to do this in time of great pain for our state," said Phoenix Sen. Kyrsten Sinema.

The girl was the youngest of the six people killed during the shooting at an event held by U.S. Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, who was among 14 people injured. Giffords was shot in the head and critically wounded.

Numerous states have passed laws restricting protests at funerals after members of the Kansas church began protesting at the funerals of soldiers killed in Iraq and Afghanistan.

What are they considering doing?  Banning any and all protests, or just those that take place near the funeral?

By all means they should be kept away from the funeral, but it's very dangerous ground when one forbids them to protest anywhere in the state.  So the details matter here.

The only thing wrong with this law is that it wasn't done sooner - for all of the families who have had a loved one's funeral picketed by this crazy group (or others).  I hope that it does go through.

TL

just at or near the funerals, to the best of my knowledge.  as hateful and hurtful as their protests are, i wholeheartedly believe in their right to protest. 

Americans don't enjoy freedom of expression.

As for them protesting, of course they should be allowed to do so (in accordance with the law of course).

Indeed.  The alternative is far less attractive, and to limit freedoms in response to such protests is to give the WBC far more power than they deserve.