elisabeth
Olympics - sending people to Russia
Posted on: 07/29/2013 00:40
There has been a lot of discussion in the news about the new law passed in Russia which makes it against the law to basically promote equality for GLBT people. On the Canadian travel advisory web site the Canadian Government makes it clear that it is not against the law in Russian to be "homosexual" however; you can't in any way promote it. This is a bit of a bind when coming from a country where not only is being GLBT ok but we are able to get legally married, adopt, participate in surrogacy agreements to have children and in fact have the right not to be discriminated against under our Charter of Rights and Freedoms.
So the IOC, seems to have a bit of a problem as they have given the winter games to this country and the rest of the world (or at least the rest of the world who are sending athletes) will be arriving very soon in Russia in order to participate in the Olympics. To date as far as I have read the IOC is saying that they will not change the venue. They say that they have been in discussions with Russia officials and they have received assurances "from the highest level" that none of "our" athletes or support staff will be prosecuted under this law. Presumably that means that our GLB athletes can go and talk about their lives and their partners without being harassed and jailed. But this does not stop the atrocities that are taking place in Russia at this time.
I cannot help that history is repeating itself. I remember as a child and then in University sitting in shame as I listened to teachers and then professors explain how the populous of the time allowed the Olympics to go on when Hitler hosted the games. We were told that the reason that this happened was that no one really knew at that point what was happening to the Jews. But we were assured that had we known the world would have stood up, side by side with our Jewish brothers and sisters and certainly the games would not have gone on. Generally at that point the teacher says something like - we as Canadians- as a nation are so sorry that we did not do the right thing at that time. Well this time we do know what Russia is doing. We need to stand up and make a statement.
The Chef .... of the Canadian team for 2012 is Gay and he is arguing that the games must go on because the athletes have been training hard and they should not be the ones who are sacrificed at the table of politics. I do understand what he is saying. But can we compromise. How about what about delaying the games one year, selecting a new country, one that reflects the morals that are supposed to reflect what the games are supposedly stand for, to host the games. Certainly, there are many winter nations that already have geography and a lot of the infrastructure in place to host the games. The point is that it would be better to have games that are less flashy than to go down in history as pandering to another regime, like the Nazis that are killing their own people because it would be too expensive or inconvenient to change a venue at this point. The argument that the world should gather in a nation while they were exterminating the Jews in massive ovens because it would be financially difficult for the commerical sponsors or causes the athletes inconvenience is an obsense argument. It is just as obsense when used against GLBT peoples and their families and friends. But perhaps you say that GLBT people are not being exterminated like the Jews. Except the news coming out of Russia is that the new law is being used as an excuse for squads to round up young Gay men who are then tortured, sexually abused and then video outed, arrested and jailed. I expect that those young men will not live long.
The other problem is how can the Canadian government, send their athletes to Russia. I have read the travel advisory on the Canadian web site to Russia. It is clear that just telling Russian people that in Canada is it normal for same sex couples to be married and have children (biological and adopted) would be violating the law. It seems to me that if we are going to send our team this year then we will be forced to muzzle them and tell them that they cannot talk about GLBT issues (ie tell them to pretend that GLBT people do not exist) , or tell them go ahead talk all they want because our government has negotiated an exemption for you alone for these games. The second suggestion is hypocrisy and if in fact western athletes, support staff and journalists are allowed to talk freely within the Olympic village the concern I have is it is likely to create a feeling of comfort within the Russian GLTB community. This feeling of comfort will then foster a belief in Russia that in fact it is safe to be a GLTB person or support a GLTB person only to find once the world departs the draconian laws are still in effect.
So what do we do? The only thing that we can do is control our own actions. Do not buy Russian goods, do not send our athletes to this country. Perhaps if all of the western nations refuse to send their athletes, maybe Russia would realize that they have finally stepped over a line and back down? But even if Russia does not change it's ways, we will know that we have not been complicit in this wrong - we finally will have done the right thing - and when we look back through the dusty pages of history this time as a nation we will not have to say "We are sorry".
Search
Recently Active...
Comments
RitaTG
Posted on: 08/14/2013 08:21
....and Dcn Jae's attitude has demonstrated why it is up to us that actually care to struggle and work for laws and change so that we are all treated fairly.
Tha baptist tradition has a long and colourful tradition of struggling for the lead in opposing such basic human rights struggles.
Regards
Rita
Kimmio
Posted on: 08/14/2013 08:37
....and Dcn Jae's attitude has demonstrated why it is up to us that actually care to struggle and work for laws and change so that we are all treated fairly.
Tha baptist tradition has a long and colourful tradition of struggling for the lead in opposing such basic human rights struggles.
Regards
Rita
To be fair- not MLK or Tommy Douglas. Can't name anyone else though. Regardless of what faction is oppressing LGBT people, it shouldn't happen.
RitaTG
Posted on: 08/14/2013 08:56
Hello Kimmo ...... I agree that there are many factions that oppose LGBT rights.
I have focused on the baptist tradition for this conversation to address comments made by Dcn Jae from his baptist viewpoint. Actually in the USA they are one of the leaders in the fight against LGBT rights and have openly supported the Russian law.
Regards
Rita
chansen
Posted on: 08/14/2013 10:23
Ahhh...Christian Love at work.
InannaWhimsey
Posted on: 08/14/2013 12:36
more news on the birthing of the kingdom of g_d
more grassroots activism
Nick Symmonds for the win
all praise Zhukov
Dcn. Jae
Posted on: 08/14/2013 16:07
....and Dcn Jae's attitude has demonstrated why it is up to us that actually care to struggle and work for laws and change so that we are all treated fairly.
Tha baptist tradition has a long and colourful tradition of struggling for the lead in opposing such basic human rights struggles.
Regards
Rita
In Russia, as it used to be in Canada, every adult has the freedom to wed any other consenting adult of the opposite gender who is not already married. Sounds equal and fair to me.
RitaTG
Posted on: 08/14/2013 16:18
Yes Dcn Jae ..... of course it would sound fair to you.....
And before 1967 there were states in the USA where you were free to marry someone as long as they were of the same colour you were....
Seems there was a lot of baptist support for that old law too ..... and even recently.
Was it not a baptist church in the news just within this last year that was against interracial marriage and did not want to marry a couple? Of course we are supposed to respect their "religious freedom".
Quite fair ...... great analogy ..... thank you.....
Regards
Rita
BetteTheRed
Posted on: 08/14/2013 17:43
Sounds equal and fair to me.
Absolutely equal and fair for all cisgender heterosexuals.
And what about equal and fair for the rest of a society? They don't deserve human rights? Give your head a shake, Jae. I don't believe that you can't get over this particular bs and onto something where sinking your teeth in might actually do some good, like systemic economic equality, homelessness, etc.
chansen
Posted on: 08/14/2013 17:45
Sounds equal and fair to me.
Absolutely equal and fair for all cisgender heterosexuals.
And what about equal and fair for the rest of a society? They don't deserve human rights? Give your head a shake, Jae. I don't believe that you can't get over this particular bs and onto something where sinking your teeth in might actually do some good, like systemic economic equality, homelessness, etc.
Jae has a very hard time not thinking about homosexuality. I'm not sure what that means.
Dcn. Jae
Posted on: 08/14/2013 18:32
Sounds equal and fair to me.
Absolutely equal and fair for all cisgender heterosexuals.
And what about equal and fair for the rest of a society? They don't deserve human rights? Give your head a shake, Jae. I don't believe that you can't get over this particular bs and onto something where sinking your teeth in might actually do some good, like systemic economic equality, homelessness, etc.
Systematic economic equality, homelessness etc. may well be issues worthy of consideration. They are, however, not the topic of this particular thread. Care to start a new one or two?
Dcn. Jae
Posted on: 08/14/2013 18:33
Sounds equal and fair to me.
Absolutely equal and fair for all cisgender heterosexuals.
And what about equal and fair for the rest of a society? They don't deserve human rights? Give your head a shake, Jae. I don't believe that you can't get over this particular bs and onto something where sinking your teeth in might actually do some good, like systemic economic equality, homelessness, etc.
Jae has a very hard time not thinking about homosexuality. I'm not sure what that means.
And you have a very hard time not thinking about Christianity. You're one of the most frequent posters on these Christian forums. Guess that makes you my brother in Christ, huh.
BetteTheRed
Posted on: 08/14/2013 19:11
You didn't answer my question, Jae.
What about equal rights for those who are not cisgendered and/or heterosexual? What do you propose that countries like Russia should do about the human rights of those people? I just don't know why, if you can't even see something as basic as human rights, you bother participating in a thread.
RitaTG
Posted on: 08/14/2013 20:27
I doubt Dcn Jae will address the issue.
He seems to have a lot of trouble facing and exploring an issue he is uncomfortable with.
Regards
Rita
SG
Posted on: 08/14/2013 21:28
When Jae can tell me honestly and conclusively who he believes I should be able to marry, a real conversation might begin. Until then it is empty,unconsidered and uncaring rhetorc. My human rights, as a human and inhabitant of this planet, according to the UN Universal Human Rights Artcle 1, I am born free and am an equal in dignity and rights. According to Article 2, I am entitled to those rights without distinction of birth. According to Article 3, I have the right to life and liberty and security of person.... Article 6, I have the right to recognition as a person. Article 7, I am to be equal before the law. Article 12, I should not subject to abitrary interference with my privacy or attacks on my honour or reputation. Then, lo and behold we get to Article 16 that says people have the right to marry. Jae, who- in your opinion- are those who are deemed intersex free to marry?
RobbieJean
Posted on: 08/14/2013 21:16
....and Dcn Jae's attitude has demonstrated why it is up to us that actually care to struggle and work for laws and change so that we are all treated fairly.
Tha baptist tradition has a long and colourful tradition of struggling for the lead in opposing such basic human rights struggles.
Regards
Rita
In Russia, as it used to be in Canada, every adult has the freedom to wed any other consenting adult of the opposite gender who is not already married. Sounds equal and fair to me.
Apparently we have to make this personal. You love your wife, right? Now imagine that your society would not allow you to marry her. You could be arrested for holding her hand, kissing her, publicly declaring you love her. You cannot mention her at all to your coworkers, because you boss could fire you for your relationship. You can't adopt or have children.
Oh, and in Russia, because you love your wife, you will be beaten up or killed on the street, and your death will be celebrated.
That is what is happening. That is why we must fight for the civil and legal rights off a orientations and identities. And by the way, religous grounds for marriage should not be applicable in secular institutions. Dozens of cultures allow for marriages between men and between women, cultures that have existed for centuries. This isn't about traditional thinking, this is a fear of the shift of power from the conservative religious authorities to moderate perspectives.
As a Bisexual woman, I am fighting for the right of my fellow LGBT people to live and love in peace. As a Christian, my faith compels me to protect and defend those who are oppressed.
I have no other words for you, Mr. Jae, other than your worldview is incredibly small, and sad. I shall pray for you.
Dcn. Jae
Posted on: 08/14/2013 22:42
You didn't answer my question, Jae.
What about equal rights for those who are not cisgendered and/or heterosexual?
Bette, as I've already expressed, I believe that it already is equal. As I already said, "In Russia, as it used to be in Canada, every adult has the freedom to wed any other consenting adult of the opposite gender who is not already married. Sounds equal and fair to me."
Where do you see the inequality?
Pinga
Posted on: 08/14/2013 22:49
Why do people engage with Jae when he starts down these threads once again.
The pattern is the same each & every time....and even if this one were to be different result, it won't be long before it happens again.
You know that there are patterns of behaviour which would indicate
a) he is struggling
b) he is intetionally being a shit disturber
or
c) he is truly an obnoxious unstable man.
Now, you can choose other options to describe his behaviour; however, the patterns have been fairly consistent over the years.
It is sad to engage with him and let people like RobbieJean become victims of it.
Dcn. Jae
Posted on: 08/14/2013 22:51
Oh, and in Russia, because you love your wife, you will be beaten up or killed on the street, and your death will be celebrated.
That is what is happening. That is why we must fight for the civil and legal rights off a orientations and identities.
This is why I celebrate the equality that already exists.
InannaWhimsey
Posted on: 08/14/2013 22:58
Why do people engage with Jae when he starts down these threads once again.
The pattern is the same each & every time....and even if this one were to be different result, it won't be long before it happens again.
You know that there are patterns of behaviour which would indicate
a) he is struggling
b) he is intetionally being a shit disturber
or
c) he is truly an obnoxious unstable man.
Now, you can choose other options to describe his behaviour; however, the patterns have been fairly consistent over the years.
It is sad to engage with him and let people like RobbieJean become victims of it.
I grok :3
I'll set myself to DNFTT for this 1 person.
chansen
Posted on: 08/14/2013 23:11
Sounds equal and fair to me.
Absolutely equal and fair for all cisgender heterosexuals.
And what about equal and fair for the rest of a society? They don't deserve human rights? Give your head a shake, Jae. I don't believe that you can't get over this particular bs and onto something where sinking your teeth in might actually do some good, like systemic economic equality, homelessness, etc.
Jae has a very hard time not thinking about homosexuality. I'm not sure what that means.
And you have a very hard time not thinking about Christianity. You're one of the most frequent posters on these Christian forums. Guess that makes you my brother in Christ, huh.
Actually, that was a pretty clever reply. Well done.
The problem is, we both know you're trolling these people. Deep down, I don't think you're bigoted enough to actually oppose same sex marriage. I think you're just playing a game with us and spouting Baptist positions for fun.
RobbieJean
Posted on: 08/15/2013 08:38
Sounds equal and fair to me.
Absolutely equal and fair for all cisgender heterosexuals.
And what about equal and fair for the rest of a society? They don't deserve human rights? Give your head a shake, Jae. I don't believe that you can't get over this particular bs and onto something where sinking your teeth in might actually do some good, like systemic economic equality, homelessness, etc.
Jae has a very hard time not thinking about homosexuality. I'm not sure what that means.
And you have a very hard time not thinking about Christianity. You're one of the most frequent posters on these Christian forums. Guess that makes you my brother in Christ, huh.
Actually, that was a pretty clever reply. Well done.
The problem is, we both know you're trolling these people. Deep down, I don't think you're bigoted enough to actually oppose same sex marriage. I think you're just playing a game with us and spouting Baptist positions for fun.
I got to agree with you Chansen. No one is this ignorant unless they are getting their jollies out of it. Somehow the idea of 2 people loving each other scares the shit out of him.
chansen
Posted on: 08/15/2013 21:14
Thing is, Jae has a Korean wife. You've got to be monumentally ignorant to be in a mixed race marriage and oppose same sex marriage. I get the impression Jae plays dumb just to get a rise out of people.
Jobam
Posted on: 08/21/2013 22:21
Coming Out
‘Prison Break’ star Wentworth Miller declines Russian invite, comes out as gay
Actor and screenwriter Wentowrth Miller, best known for his role on the Fox series “Prison Break,” came out as gay on Wednesday in an open letter in which he declined an invitation to be a guest of honor at the St. Petersburg International Film Festival in Russia.
Wentworth Miller
Citing Russia’s recently enacted anti-gay “propaganda” law, Miller, 41, said he “cannot in good conscience participate in a celebratory occasion hosted by a country where people like myself are being systematically denied their basic right to live and love openly.”
In a letter to festival director Maria Averbakh, and published by GLAAD, Miller, writes:
“Wentworth’s bold show of support sends a powerful message to LGBT Russians, who are facing extreme violence and persecution: you are not alone,” said GLAAD spokesperson Wilson Cruz.
“As people from across the globe continue to speak out against Russia’s horrific law, more celebrities and corporations should follow his courageous lead in openly condemning Russia’s anti-LGBT law,” added Cruz.
Hilary
Posted on: 08/22/2013 14:16
Wentworth Miller -
Dcn. Jae
Posted on: 08/22/2013 15:06
I saw on the news today that the Russian government has promised the IOC that they will not discriminate against gay athletes during the Olympics :)
Really, I think that's a nice short-range solution for the Russians.
Tip-of-the-iceberg slap-in-the-face kind of stuff.
InannaWhimsey
Posted on: 08/22/2013 15:08
Go wenworth miller!!!
The snowball grows and grows and grows...
Expecting soonishly: oil company CEO (Rosneft) & Rossiya Bank CEO threatening to pull out of Russia...
Dcn. Jae
Posted on: 08/23/2013 14:10
Really, I think that's a nice short-range solution for the Russians.
Tip-of-the-iceberg slap-in-the-face kind of stuff.
It's like a boy telling his mother, "Don't worry Mommy, I won't punch my little brother while we're in church."
InannaWhimsey
Posted on: 08/25/2013 00:30
such a sweet couple
Arminius
Posted on: 08/25/2013 10:36
Wentworth Miller -
Another couple of thumbs up from me.
chansen
Posted on: 08/28/2013 20:44
Russia is now raiding the homes of GLBT "activists":
Click for more:
http://www.advocate.com/news/world-news/2013/08/28/russia-raids-gay-peoples-homes
BetteTheRed
Posted on: 08/29/2013 07:41
It's very obvious to me, on a whole bunch of levels, that deliberate provocation is being done in order to distract people from real issues.
Economy's tanking?
Environment is stressed to the breaking point?
All the ordinary people are being screwed?
Blame the gays and/or the immigrants. Crank up the rhetoric. See how long you can keep the focus off the real problems.
revjohn
Posted on: 08/29/2013 11:10
Perhaps if all of the western nations refuse to send their athletes, maybe Russia would realize that they have finally stepped over a line and back down?
Not likely.
I mean, we boycotted the Moscow Games in 1980 pretending we were outraged by their invasion of Afghanistan which began the year before. The Soviets would not withdraw from Afghanistan until 1989 and they consider that war something like the Americans do the Vietnam war. A long and costly failure.
Ironically, Afghanistan did not participate in the boycott. Perhaps that is why the Soviet Union stuck around for another 9 years getting their asses handed to them.
Still we shouldn't let our failure to boycott the Americans in 1984 for their invasion of Grenada in 1983 or our failure to boycott the Chinese in 2008 for their inattention to human rights and ongoing oppression of Tibet lead us to assume precedent has been set for ignoring offensive behaviour by host countries.
Even when most of those countries don't boycott Olympiads we hold because we seem to be dragging our collective heels when it comes to treating our First Nations peoples well. Heck, most would probably settle for equal but I digress.
I really do not know what the best answer is here. Quite frankly, I would want to hear from the LGBT Community in Moscow itself. If they felt strongly one way or another about a boycott being good for them or bad for them I'd take that into consideration.
While Russia's new hateful law forbids propaganda of "non-traditional sexual relations" it doesn't appear to forbid brightly coloured uniforms.
The Canadian Women's team, just this year, opened the world championships in Livestrong colours. Nobody was confused thinking that there was suddenly a team from Lower Livestrongistan playing.
Sure our national colours tend to be red and white but I'm not sure of any IOC ruling that limits Countries to a select palette of colours. I may be wrong but I think that it is the NOC (National Olympic Committee) which has the final say in the appearance of the uniform and if the Canadian Olympic Committee wanted to maintain a Canadian motif with say a uniform that had a multitude of Maple Leaves in an assortment of colours then that is their decision to make.
I mean our flag is pretty unique and it you swapped out the plain red bars and leaf for something more multi-hued I think most would still recognize that it was a Canadian flag and hey, if somebody asked what was going on our athletes could say that "being Red all the time is boring."
And when you think about it whatever we did with the maple leaff the Americans could do with a star. I would think that the UK could swap out the red and blue on the Union Jack for something a little more colourful without folk getting confused about which country they were from.
Not that I think such a thing will happen. I'm just saying that it could happen.
Grace and peace to you.
John
InannaWhimsey
Posted on: 08/30/2013 20:26
more of Stalinist Russia
graeme
Posted on: 09/17/2013 15:45
There are a great many countries that discriminate as Russia does. It's not a thousaand years ago that Canada and the US were two of them.
The Olymmpics I don't expect to happen is Tokyo. I suspect the readiation crisis iniJapan is far worse than we have been led to think.
InannaWhimsey
Posted on: 09/18/2013 07:38
Alex
Posted on: 09/18/2013 11:52
On the 3rd of this month LGBT activists and their allies held demonstrations in many Russian cities to thank their supporters around the world for speaking out against the new anti-gay law in Russia. The participants all brought home made signs, amny of which can be seen on their facebook page. https://www.facebook.com/straights.for.equality/photos_stream
elisabeth
Posted on: 01/08/2014 02:37
I was very saddened to see that our Canadian team did nothing to support LGBT athletes and the LGBT community and their friends and family in Russia. I have a friend who is an Immigration lawyer and he tells me that the human rights abuses that are coming out of Russia since the bill discriminating against LGBT people are atrocious.
Given that our government has chosen to do nothing but lip service about this issue - not so much as wear a rainbow flag on our uniforms - I will take a stand by refusing to watch or listen to any of the Olympics this year. I will also not purchase any Olympics merchandise.
Although this seems like a futile exercise at least when I am turning off the radio, switching off the TV and choosing not to wear the mits, hats, shirts etc, I will know that I have not supported an event sponsored by a bigoted regime. I choose not to be a part of discrimination. The rest of Canada can make its own choice.
chansen
Posted on: 01/08/2014 16:29
Has anyone thought of contacting the Russion Orthodox Church? They're helping to drive this law, so, like people were protesting and contacting the LDS church over California's Prop 8, it seems important to appeal to the ROC to not judge GLBT people and reverse position to oppose the law.
Is there no Christian-to-Christian appeal that could help here?
RitaTG
Posted on: 01/08/2014 17:07
....a good idea chansen....
I will look into this....
Thanks!
Rita
chansen
Posted on: 01/09/2014 14:51
When I say "contacting", I should probably say "protesting".
You "contact" a group who wants you ticketed for parking your car where you say it should be acceptable. You "protest" a group who wants you arrested for saying that your non-harmful sexuality is acceptable.
somegalfromcan
Posted on: 01/09/2014 15:09
Does anyone else find it ironic that the torch bearer uniforms are reminiscent of rainbows?
chansen
Posted on: 01/09/2014 15:18
A guy in a uniform with a spectrum theme, holding a phallic torch?
No. Why do you ask?
Alex
Posted on: 01/09/2014 15:24
Did anyone see that the city of Vancouver is sending the husband of the moderator of the UCC to Russia before the games. He is going in place of the mayor, as it is traditional to send the mayor of former Olympic cities. Also. By sending an openlybgay man th city can show the Russians a proud and out man. The city of Vancouver will also save money because all of the transportation companies that are regulated federally provide free tickets to the Moderator and his or her family.
revjohn
Posted on: 01/09/2014 15:30
Hi Alex,
all of the transportation companies that are regulated federally provide free tickets to the Moderator and his or her family.
Do they? That's news to me.
Grace and peace to you.
John
SG
Posted on: 01/09/2014 17:46
High profile LGBTQ folks will be relatively safe because of that high profile. Has anyone heard the stuff about hearts and burning folks alive? Or when a dictator holding power through brutality, scapegoating and horror does stuff will we once more say "wow, never saw that slaughter about to happen. " Or "why didn't I hear about that?"
Alex
Posted on: 01/09/2014 20:20
Hi Alex,
all of the transportation companies that are regulated federally provide free tickets to the Moderator and his or her family.
Do they? That's news to me.
Grace and peace to you.
John
Under Scedule B of An Act incorporating The United Church of Canada.[Assented to 19th July, 1924.] all Moderators get free access to ride trains and interprovincial bus lines. Schedule S (including free travel on Trans Canada Airlines (now called Air Canada)was added after 1936 when TCA was created.
graeme
Posted on: 01/09/2014 20:59
It is surely disgusting that we are so pretentious and self-righteous on an issue for which we have only recently (and partially) changed our ways. This is especially so since we gave the games to Britain with its record of slaughter and abuse for centuries, to the US when it was dropping Agent orange on vietnam. In fact, if the games are to be a show place for virtue, I should find it extremely difficult to think of any country we could give them to.
We should also get over our notion that the games are some great, spiritual event. They modern games began as a private affair for the very rich. Then it quickly became a pretty crass, commercial venture, still controlled by the very, very rich - as it is to this day.
It's nice to see somebody run fast or jump high. But it is not a form of worship, and hasn't been since Ancient Greece. It's nice to watch. But there's no sense in seeing anything symbolic or spiritual in it.
Spiritually and intellecually, the games are in a class with sitting on the couch and drinking beers while watching hockey on TV.
SG
Posted on: 01/09/2014 21:08
I agree we each have our own history and that boycotts are not very effective... that, in the grand scheme of things the olympics is chump change. That said, there are stances and policies that the world should pay attention to.
If we decide to say, "well they did A and we did B... so we will simply let everything get a pass" that does not seem any more productive.
chansen
Posted on: 01/09/2014 22:20
Remeber the free trip accross Canada Mardi Tindal took on VIA Rail, if not ask Jae about it
Have you learned nothing from my mistakes?
revjohn
Posted on: 01/14/2014 16:08
Hi Alex,
Under Scedule B of An Act incorporating The United Church of Canada.[Assented to 19th July, 1924.]
Schedule B deals with Trusts of Model Deed and that does not pertain to the travel of Moderators. I believe that you are pulling our collective legs. Well done.
There is no Schedule S either.
It's the real reason people aspire to be moderator,(just think, free trips to Flin Flon, anytime one wants to go)
Well. That is a hard argument to refute.
Remeber the free trip accross Canada Mardi Tindal took on VIA Rail, if not ask Jae about it
If it were not for the discussion about the trip I doubt that I would remember it.
Grace and peace to you.
John