Widowsmite, please, please, please don't EVER think your daughter would be better off without you. She would be crushed and I know that it doesn't seem that way to you right now, but losing a parent is awful and suicide will be a guilt trip that she may never recover from.(not to mention how devasting it would be for your husband and son)

I think teenagers can be arrogant, self centred little brats sometimes. They have not finished developing and maturing mentally and they will press parents buttons as many times as they feel like it, BUT let's not forget that they are developing young people and we (mine are grown now) are the parents and how we handle these situations will make a difference as to how long it will take to get through this mess.

This is how I would handle it, and others may tell you different, but this is mine. First i would make sure she knows that she is welcome to come back home anytime and that you love her very much. Give her a key. I would make sure that I would tell her that I will be willing to talk about things that she needs to talk about and that I will listen to what she has to say about the yelling. Listening is the hard part, but she'll need to listen too. When she yells, don't yell back. Don't justify her reason to yell back. Just tell her you love her and you'll wait until she wants to talk. Tell her you'll always be there for her and try to stay in touch.

I hear you when you think parenting is a thankless job. Some kids say thankyou when they're young and others not until they have a family of their own and then it dawns on them. You'll see them implementing things in their family that you've taught them. Hang in there Mom, it may seem like a long haul sometimes, but the payoff is worth it.

When you can focus on the love, it disarms the hate.

Widowsmite, it truly sounds like you have done whatever you can to help your daughter. I can understand how frustrating and upsetting this experience must be for you and your family. I can tell you that no matter how fragile your relationship is, she still needs you to be there when she is ready to come home.

 Has your family considered getting family counselling? 

Widowsmite,

Your post could have been written by any number of parents. I am sure many will share their experience and insight.

What concerns me is this paragraph.

"Then I started thinking...this life may be too much for me. Would it be better if I wasn't around? Would she come home if for some reason I wasn't there anymore?  Her one email to her Dad was she would contact him if he didn't tell me, but hasn't since, does that mean that she would be safe and at home if I wasn't here? I watched the sun come up on my steps outside last night, bundled in my jacket, staring at the clouds. I don't have an answer, I don't have anything."

If you are having thoughts that put you in danger, please reach out to someone.

I have been in counselling for a year. She wouldn't go. The issue seems to be with me but I can't figure it out. I think that is why I blew. I was told to enforce the love, and did that. Telling her I love you and I think this is the way to go....but that day, everything came to a head. I never ever would think of calling my mother a name, or a liar. She never talked to me when she was here. She used her room like it was an apartment and only came down to feed or go to work or school and even then left it to the last minute so that she didn't have to talk to any of us. Thanks for replying.

I have been in counselling since last year and used the phrase, I love you and need you to know.... a lot. I email her I love you, you can come back anytime etc. and I got back the word No and The reason I hate you is self explanatory.

People that know me, along with my husband and son are perplexed at this statement, but again, if you could see her facebook posts, her 347 "friends" people I have never heard of or have ever seen tell her she should go out on her own etc. Funny thing is they are all home with the exception of two girls who were from broken homes and moved out.

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I really appreciate it.

Widowsmite, I don't have any kids, but I do remember butting heads with my mom as a teen!  I never took off though, hopefully others have more advice for you about that. My mom and I had the yelling relationship.  We would argue and yell until we came to some type of compromise.  My sister was the one who couldn't stand yelling, she used to be sneaky to avoid any conflict.

Emotions tend to be more intense when we're teenagers, but we don't want to take out frustrations with friends, so it usually comes out with family.  When your daughter is yelling, try not to yell back, rather try to figure out what the issues are.  It may be aggravating, but you are the adult and you need to do what you can to stay calm, even if it means taking a bit of time and space first.  She may need space first when she's upset.  Maybe some counselling will help you communicate with her better?

Hopefully she'll be back soon.  It sounds like things are calmer between her and your husband?  Perhaps letting him take the lead when she's back would be the best start.  Let her initiate the dialogue with you.  You can learn some amazing things sometimes if you just listen to the message behind the outbursts.

Facebook isn't the issue, it's just another communication tool that we have now.  There was always the possibility to block people, I don't think facebook changed that aspect too much.

When it comes to her complaining about you to her friends, I think that being a good parent means you're going to be called the meanest parent in the whole world (or something to that effect) at some point.

I really wish she would talk, would have talked. I wanted her to come  back and talk after she left but she won't acknowledge me unless I offer to pay for something. We received a letter about her graduation and I asked her in an email if I could pay for it, as I did for her brother, not knowing if she was still going to school or not. She is seventeen and supposedly we are her contacts but that she changed. She emailed quickly back yes, and I transferred the money to her account. That was the end of the conversation. I use to go into her room and ask Can we Talk? and she would say No , get out of my room please.This happened at least once a week.

The reason I am upset about facebook is the customization. You can even have an enemies list now. Her close friends hear her rant, which included in-laws all over Canada, but since the inlaws aren't close they didn't alert me to her problems they were reading. They just thought it was funny I guess.

I had a really hard childhood, except for sexual abuse, I had the rest. I loved my parents though and respected them for trying. During my teen years, I never ever would think of putting them through this. I probably couldn't have done it to myself.

Thanks for your insight. Much much appreciated.

I wanted to comment on this too, but SG beat me to it.  I agree with SG, the most important thing is to deal with this issue first!

Oh and Widowsmite, I wouldn't cut yourself off from your church just because you're afraid of what some might think or say. Some will offer the "tsk tsk" of non understanding but church is for the broken and weary and there will be some who will be empathetic and understanding. It's worth the risk and it's even worth it to just go and pray and feel the peace of Jesus in a quiet place.

Last night I couldn't sleep, was up alone, outside trying to find out why God wasn't answering my prayers. The thought that maybe if I wasn't here was a question I asked myself, not really thinking suicide at the time, just what if? What if I am the problem here and my husband could have his daughter back? Or my son his sister? They didn't do anything but are paying the price for me not being able to hold my tongue for the millionth time.

At first my husband did blame me, and he had to get in line as I was at the head of that blame. I said those dread words, words I promised myself I would never say again If you don't like it here....

That was a saying my father said to us at any disagreement. We heard it at least twice a week since we were able to understand language. It just comes out. I immediately apologized and told her I didn't mean it, and actually had a discussion about saying it a few months back when my son and daughter were in the car and I was taking them to work. I told them if I said that, that I was at the end of my rope and please just let me cool down and don't take it verbatim. My daughter my son tells me now didn't hear the discussion as her earphones were in, like they always were so that she could not hear me talk. So he heard it but she didn't. I don't know if that would have made any difference, if I had known she wasn't part of that discussion. But, as I stated before, I could talk all I wanted but she never listened to a word I said unless it had to do with me buying or paying for something.

Thank you. I need to heal. Church always did that for me before, and I hope will help again.I know God answers prayers, just not always the way you want him to. I think he led me back to WonderCafe for this reason. I haven't been here for a while either. I never wanted to think of myself as a failure. Not that I am use to succeeding, just that I try so hard to accomplish things and make things better. I am known for my level headedness and voice of reason. You wouldn't think that with my situation right?

The reason I was questioning my reason for being here is my daughters last text 39 days ago to my husband was Why did you marry such a tyrant? and it brought back her scathing remark months ago when she said again under her breath as I was leaving her room after asking her if I could talk to her, 'ever thought about committing suicide?" I at first thought it was a smart remark, but again last night,I was so beaten and low, these are the memories I have of her.

Okay, so you said the words, "if you don't like it here leave". You can't take it back, but now you've learned you're not going to say that again (at least until they are old enough to actually be able to afford to leave) Don't beat yourself up, as long as she's safe where she is, you have time to fix this. First get those thoughts of suicide out of your head. I'm sure you think by doing that, she'll be sorry and then realize that she loves you afterall, but I want you to know that without even knowing you I know.......SHE LOVES YOU ALREADY!!! She's going through some stuff right now. She'll yell at YOU because shes secure in the fact that you're a safe person to dump on.(you won't go away) You've always been there and deep down she knows that. Suicide will never get you what you really want, and isn't that to reconnect with your daughter someday? So tell me, are you thinking of suicide now?

No, today I am glad I am alive.

Can you tell me why you feel that way, Widowsmite?

Because my son is sitting on the couch near me, my dog is lying next to him, I am calm and not forcing myself to look inward as much as I was last night. I don't feel as frail, as beat up and spit out as I did as I do, when night falls.

I have no answers to the questions I seek, I have nothing but my faith. Faith that whatever happens happens. I have control over myself, and nothing else.

Thanks for the dialogue. Bless you for being out there.

Hi Widowsmite,

I'm an admin here at WonderCafe. Like others, I am concerned by your words. Please reach out for help if need it! We have a list of phone numbers people can call for help from wherever they are. You can find it here:

http://suicideprevention.wikia.com/wiki/International_Suicide_Prevention_Directory

The situations we face can be very difficult at the time, but there is also the possibility that things can change with time and bring resolution and healing. Let time work. We will hold you in our prayers and thoughts. If there is anything WonderCafe can do to help, please let me know by messaging me directly.

Peace and love to you.

Aaron for WonderCafe

Are you worried about tonight?

Please use those numbers that Aaron gave you if need be.

I am fine, thanks for your concern. Last night was a low point in my life, but I got through it. I will again. Sometimes, when you try to find a solution to a problem, you have to weed out a lot of things you have to look at and put aside. It wasn't killing myself that was a real thought, more just walking away from my life. To walk I would need a body.

No I am fine, leaving a situation doesn't mean leaving your body behind.  Walking away seemed an option. If I left, walked away from my family and house, would my daughter come back? I am more equipped to handle the world than she is. There were a lot of thoughts last night. Maybe the cold got to me? I don't know.

Thanks for the support.

Thanks for the reassurance Widowsmite. But remember, if there is anything we can help with please let us know.

Sometimes when children rebel, we take it personally and we get caught up in their personal struggles. It's very hard to just sit back and watch a child go through a crisis, especially if you're used to being the one that steps in for everything. Trust that you've equipped her positively for whatever she's going through and like Chemgal said, if it's her Dad that is able to keep in closer touch with her right now, then it might be better to step back and let him do that. If you walk away in any shape or form right now you will cause the same hurt to others that she has caused in you, and you wouldn't want that, would you?

I lost my mother when I was only 17 and would have loved to have been able to have grown into a more mature relationship with her as time went on. Please don't deprive yourselves of that future opportunity. She'll need you again someday.

I am so sorry to hear about your mother. I lost mine ten years ago and the pain is still there.

I have high blood pressure and suffer also from panic attacks. Luckily the panic attacks are not that often. The day she left, I was curled up in a ball in the kitchen, having a doozy of a panic attack ( the forth) and my chest was on fire. I was trying to control my breathing with a soft towel and crying worse than I ever remembered. She stood beside me and said "Are you done yet? I have to get my bathing suit out of the bathroom." I scuttled across the floor to give her access to the bathroom. That was the last time I saw her face. It was wobbly and not in focus. I don't want that to be the last time I see her.

She hasn't contacted my husband since the last time about two weeks ago, she isn't answering. I think that is bothering me most of all. He doesn't deserve to be treated like this because of something I did.

Widowsmite, the bathroom thing sounds like she wanted to know that you were ok while still staying angry.

I've been thinking, you said you gave your children as many free choices as possible.  Could that be part of the issue?  She has new friends, she wants to fit in, but maybe they are doing things that she doesn't want to be doing.  It's a heck of a lot easier to complain about strict and mean parents than it is to say you don't want to do something.

i never thought of that! That gives me hope, thanks!!!!

Please share the numbers Aaron left for you with your family, widowsmite.  We are not always the best judge of our mental state when we've been through the mill....and you have been.

Counselling is based on understanding but it sometimes falls short of what is needed.  Often correction rather than understanding is the issue with teens.  You may glean some insight from "In Sheep's Clothing" by George K. Simon, as he addresses some parenting issues similar to yours.  He also has a blog if you care to google it. 

Treat yourself with respect, widowsmite...as well as respecting others.  It's crucial in your situation.  Thoughts of courage and love sent your way. 

I'm actually a little embarrassed at how easily I can recall back to my teenage thinking patterns!   I'm younger than most on here, but not that young anymore.  Hopefully my memory helps a little bit though!

Do you have a friend who has kids that had some issues in their teens that are now grown up?  I know my mom really enjoyed talking to a friend at times.  It's not professional help, but sometimes it's good to know that someone else lived through it and things mostly worked out!

I will. Thanks so much for your help. God Bless

Its funny you asked that. For the first three weeks, I think I asked everyone. Lots said oh yes that kind of happened to me and then told their story. It gave me hope. Then one lady from church who is a grandmother said her granddaughter ran away at 15. She came back when she was 23 but they hadn't had any contact in the interim. That had me spiralling out of control so I stopped asking.....

Hello Widowsmite, 

I am so very sorry to hear of the difficult situation you find yourself in with your daughter.  I have three children, not so different in age from yours, but have been very fortunate not to have faced the challenges you now face with your daughter.  I do however, know of those who have, and I lived it to a degree in my own family as well when I was younger.  

I have a younger sister who has a volatile personality, at least as far as her family members are concerned.  There are four of us and I think my parents tried their best to treat us equally but we are all so very different.  I recall screaming matches and doors slammed in heated arguments between my sister and my parents, which worsened when she was in high school.  One of my brothers, who has a similar temperament, did run away for a few days, but came back and has had a good relationship with my parents as an adult.  My sister is in her forties now and though successful in her personal life, still has significant disagreements with my parents as well as my two other siblings.  My parents treat her with kid gloves to this day, never knowing what they might say next that will set her off and keep her from speaking with them for months or sometimes even years at a time.  I have faced more than one verbal assault from her as well and have learned to keep my distance - a form of emotional self preservation.  

I also know of people my age who have had trouble with their teenaged children as well,  even though from all outward appearances,  they seem to have done their best to raise them well.  

We have all said things to our children that we regretted saying: things said in the heat of the moment, usually when we were tired and frustrated.  (None of us likes to hear our parents negative words come out of our own mouths, though I think we all have said them....things we said we would never say. )  Please do not be so hard on yourself for having said those words to your daughter.  Many a parent has said them too. You reacted to her ongoing disrespect.  She reacted to your words in a way that most teenagers would not.  You could not have known that she would take you literally.

It is fine to say that "I am the adult and she is the child" but we are still human beings who expect to be treated with kindness and respect by those we love and whom we hope love us.

While it is true that teenagers have brains that are different than those of adults,  they can have mental illness and personality disorders as well.  It may very well be that you did absolutely nothing wrong.  Putting blame on yourself will not help or change things.  It is unfortunate that your daughter would not go to counselling with you, as this might have provided some insight into her behaviour, and how the two of you, as well as her dad, might have been better able to communicate with each other.  

While you are unable to help her at this moment, please make the effort to seek help and care for yourself.  I can imagine that you feel powerless, but you need to look after yourself for your own sake and for the sake of your son and husband, who are not doubt suffering as well.  

You have told your daughter that you love her.  She is not ready to hear it.  But she is young and so there is hope for better days ahead.  Stay strong.  Try to be patient.  (yes, easy for me to say) She will be back.  It is just a matter of time.

Take care.

Widowsmite - please,, please take care of yourself.  Your husband and son love you.  Your daughter loves you too, even if she is so messed up right now that she doesn't realize it or know how to express it.

Perenting isn't easy.  I know there were many nights when I laid awake wondering why my daughter was trying to destroy her life - the friends she spent time with, the things she let them talk her into, the trouble she got into - not to mention lying to and stealing from me to give (she called it 'lend') to them.  Eventually she grew up.  I hope your daughter will too.  I know that you love her. 

(That was in the age before Facebook, for me.  I think it complicates things.)

Thank you so much for your perspective. It helps alot. God Bless you.

Thanks for replying. I know I shouldn't blame facebook, but before she had 347 friends cheering her on for her bad decisions, she use to be a nice kid. The pressure of facebook, once you post something as a teen must be enormous. Now I know that there aren't 347 friends more like aquaintances you pick up during the year but it has gotten out of hand. I don't think she would have left if she hadn't had the support of these other kids. I myself wouldn't take in another persons child for an extended period of time without contacting the family and trying to help work it out. I don't know how these people do this. She can just move on and keep moving on?

Bless your kind words, as you can see I have been thinking again and that puts me back into the box I was in last night. Fretting about things I can't change.

ah widowsmite-as a type this I am awaiting my 19 year old daughter's arrival home. She has been gone 4 days without answering e-mails or phone form me , her brothers or aunt. I had just filed a missing person report.

ARGHHH!

Parneting teens is not for sissies!

 You need a solid counsellor-and so does she. Perhaps even some family counselling.

Can you just talk to someone at church and let them put the word out for you that your daughter is not a t home? Then you wouldn't have to explain it to all.

Have you talked to the counsellor's at Vimy Ridge? Your school division also employs social workers that a school can access if needed (I used to work for EPS).

Your daughter is trying to divide you and yur husband. Present a unified fornt

and hang in there-growing up is hard work for teens-and we can just do so much-they have to do the rest!

Widowsmite and Tabitha, I am holding both of you and your daughters in prayer at this time. I pray that both will return home safely when they are ready knowing that they are loved by you. I pray for strength, wisdom and courage for you both as you face these situations. I pray that you both will find support both here and off-line too. Amen.

Wise words Tabitha.  I am holding you both - and your daughters - in my prayers.  You're posts bring back memories of worry and despair, and the pain of raising children.  No one said it would be easy - but they also didn't tell us how hard it could be.

Thanks so much for your support. Tabitha I am scared to go to the school, as she is attending still and has just a little to go to graduation. If I go there, even to talk, she could decide that I infiltrated that part of her life and take off and not finish. Vimy Ridge was a field trip some students made to France from her school.

Thanks  somegalfromcan and seeler, I think we need your prayers more than anything as God for some reason can't hear mine or has another plan for me.

Oh my friends - so so hard to hear of your worries about your daughters.  My daughter is the same age.  But Widowsmite, you can call the school and ask, and you should.  You should tell them straight up that it is a confidential thing because of the eggshells. 
I agree with counselling for you asap- emergency counselling because this is beyond normal coping skills.  And I think it is ok to remember that 17 year olds are surprisingly capable sometimes. 

A friend told me, you don't need all the answers right away, because you can get a long way in the dark with just a flashlight. 

I have kids like that around my life - no empathy or reasonable sense of relative suffering.  Boggles the mind.  All I can say is that my husband and his parents had a similar breakdown (though there was physical abuse) and now years later, we all get on pretty well. 

Barbara Coloroso's book Kids Are Worth It - talks about giving them inner discipline - an example would be always saying (or starting to say):  "I know you are smart, you can handle this.  How can I help?" and in this extreme instance being able to say "I love you.  I know you are smart - can I help you find a safe place to be while we sort this out?" and then providing resources ie: welfare, apprenticeships, phone numbers, etc and a third party person to be your link, perhaps.  Maybe in this instance it is connecting with the Guidance dept and saying "I am so worried, please help her while she won't talk to me" - which gives them important info that you want to help however you can.

Prayers will be with you because I can't take my mind off of this.  Hugs

Thanks so much for your reply. I have read the book you are referring to many times but the problem for me was my conditioning. When I get trapped in a corner, and am tired and have other things going on I snap and all my training and everything flies out the window.

I called the school today, and was told that I am not her contact and they can't give me any information. I didn't think someone under the age of 18 could do this but they can.

They wouldn't forward my call to anyone.

I haven't seen her in 41 days. She hasnt' posted anything I can see in 5. Today in the mail her grad pictures samples came. I didn't recognize the clothing and her hair is longer. They were taken three weeks ago. I was looking into the eyes of a stranger.

Here it is 16. They will not tell you anything at the school after that age.

In NB when we were having problems we were told it was 16.  At that age kids are legally able to leave home without their parents' consent and live where they please.  I also think that parents can put them out and refuse to support them.  Since they cannot sign a lease, get credit, or enter a contract until the age of majority, they are in a legal limbo. 

But seeler, they may be in limbo but Social Services in Saskatchewan will support them.

Widowsmite and Tabitha . . . caring thoughts and prayers are with both of you mom's who have children who have left home.  Your hearts must be broken and at times you must be frantic.  I've never experienced what you are living through, so I'm only guessing.

I have one daughter, who is now an adult and living somewhat independantly.  As others have mentioned we have had some mother/daughter differences over the years.  Our relationship is much better now, but unfortunately I am still the one that she takes all her life and challenge frustrations out on - but it does not happen as often . . . and when it does she apologizes almost instantly.

Again . . . Widowsmite and Tabitha - thinking of you both . . . may your daughters be safe, may they return to you soon.

I should have been clearer in my post-by the time I posted daughter was on the bus home and is here. The worry was over-but not the consequences.

Widowsmite-I misunderstood about the field trip-I thought the school was Vimy Ridge in Edmonton!

Parenting teens is sometimes REALLY challenging. Meeting our own needs is so important during it all.

Thanks for the prayers and good wishes. Journey is far from over.

Tabitha . . . I'm hoping that some day in the future the old adage "one day you will look back on this and laugh" becomes true for you.  But, you are correct . . . if and when that happens, the journey is far from over when you are raising a teen :)

Tabitha - I am so glad to hear that your daughter is home. I want to let you and Widowsmite know that over in the Room For All we have been sharing prayers for you both.  You would be welcome to join us there.

Hi Widowsmite - my kids are now 25 and 28; and for us with our daughter adolescence was hellish, and there was a time with our son that he moved out for several months due to disputes.  All this before the onslaught of facebook.   Now tho, things are VERY much better!  They're actually turning into the people I THOUGHT I was raising :-) 

For me, their adolescence was very very hard on my self esteem - much as you describe.   I echo Birthstone's comments re the wisdom of Barbara Colorosso; I also found the book  "Get out of my life, but first could you drive me & cheryl to the mall" to be quite helpful. 

From my perspective, I tried to always let them know they were loved; I wanted them to let me know they were safe, and I would not ask where they were staying, but would trust them to keep safe.   But there were clear groundrules - minimum standards that had to be met for us to live together as a family.  I tried to emphasize that it would be their decision to accept thos standards, or to live elsewhere - the choice was theirs, and I would accept it.  Talking a lot wasn't one of our minimum standards - they just can't do it at that stage.

My thoughts are with you as you navigate these treacherous waters of adolescence - girls & mums can have a pretty tough go of it.  Hang in there ... and hopefully you will both come out the other end in 10 years as friends ... that was always my prayer. 

Hi Carolla,

I agree with you .... this is a great book!  Really should be required reading for all parents of adolescents :)

Also good is "Now I Know Why Tigers Eat Their Young".

Hi Widowsmite - just thinking of you and yours today. 

Widowsmite - I was very annoyed at my 15 year old granddaughter today.  She asked me to drive her to dance rehearsal and spent the entire time in the car texting.  I was nothing more than an unpaid taxi service.

Then I remembered your daughter and remembered that you are facing real problems and real heartbreak.  I hope that you are able to cope hour by hour, day by day.  And I pray for a positive outcome. 

Hi seeler-I have a rule of no texting in the front seat as I find it too distracting! Your grand-daughter won't know you dislike it unless you gently tell her.