Its not only the 'stuff' that kids own, but its the things they do.

A few days before Christmas, granddaughter was invited to a birthday party (13 year olds).  She knew that the party would involve going to a 'spa' for an hour or so.  As she was dropped off at a big house in the suburbs, her mother wondered "How will they get 12 girls downtown for their 'pampering'?"

Well, after a hour or so 'gathering' in the reck room, chatting, texting, or whatever a dozen 13 year olds do, the birthday girl's mother called to them:  "Girls, your transportation has arrived."   And there is the driveway was a stretch limo, at their disposal to drive them around whereever they wanted for an hour before taking them to their destination.   So they directed the driver to take them down this street and that, driving past their houses and those of their classmates (boys) and hopeing to be noticed.   Then their manicures and pedicures and whatnot.  Quite a party. 

What ever happened to Pizza and music in the family rec room followed by cake and icecream?

I've never been in a stretch limo in my life!  

Yes, too much stuff!   And too many events!

We did pretty good this year.  I got my son this nifty contraption that is a fold up box with an upholstered top and can be used as a stool.  I got it so his friends have somewhere to sit when they visit and he has an extra place to put stuff.  All his gifts fit nicely inside.  This is the first year that there is nothing hanging out under the tree after Christmas.

That's part of why I'm surprised this year at how much stuff is everywhere now.  We didn't have anything hanging out under the tree; in fact, the back under the tree was empty.  Maybe it's not the stuff that's too much...maybe it's just all the packaging and wrapping paper.  Maybe once that gets taken away next week, it won't be so bad.

Christmas morning Grandson wanted to stop and play with almost every gift as he opened it.  Star Wars lego (even a small set) has a lot of little pieces to lose and takes time  and Dad's help - not the thing for the chaos of Christmas morning.  And the Wii is in the basement rec room - where someone would have to go with him to set up his new game.  At one point we all took a break - I walked the dog a bit, others got a second cup of coffee.  And when we got back to the gifts we just let grandson work on his pile at his own rate. 

I can see the advantage of the 12 days of Christmas with a gift each day - starting with the book, or the sweater, and gradually working up to the sled, the lego, and the Wii game.    Definitely too much, all at once.

We have a purge day just before the Church rummage sale in the fall and make room for new stuff.  I try to give myself a guideline - any new item of clothing going into my closet, something comes out. 

My relatives on my husband's side stunned and insulted us this year.  I'm still reeling.  There are a lot of people - 10? 12? - and we requested please no more than one gift per person, and please these specific kinds of things (passes to the zoo, swim classes, art and craft supplies.  But nooooo...  We came home with the van jam packed, to the brim, with boxes of stuffed (read, useless) toys, princesssticker books (equally useless), clothes we do not need...  I was so angry!  And so confused, too, because it's wrong to be angry when one should be grateful... or so I've been trained.  I told the in-laws as we were leaving, we can't accept this many gifts again.  We simply can't.  It teaches the wrong thing, sends the wrong message, we don't have the space or the need.  It's just wrong.  I've already told the girls that they can pick up a couple of things but the rest will be given away. 

But, I remain disturbed.  That the relatives didn't respect our requests... or consider what impact receiving 20 small and kinds useless gifts per child (I have three!)...  It's materialism gone out of its head and utterly madly insane!  I'm not participating next year!  And I have to find a way to let these otherwise lovely people know that what they are doing it wrong!

I'm wondering how your kids felt about the toys? I totally get the materialism thing, but would the toys have been cheaper than swim classes or passes to the zoo? As a child, I probably would have chosen the toys over the trip to the zoo or swimming lessons. How did the children react when you told them that they would have to give away their toys?

You say that these grandparents are lovely people, so I'm sure they weren't trying to be hurtful to you.

Oh seeler - I can so see your grandson & his lego!  When our son was in the legoland range - his grandmother used to give him a big set for Xmas - he would open it Xmas eve at her home - then when he awoke at home on Xmas morn, he'd dive right into the lego building.  There were a few years we waited patiently for him to finish before he'd come downstairs to see what Santa had left for him!

Well, Agnieska - just like kids ask Santa for certain things - they may or may not get their wishes.  Sounds like your in-laws showered your kids with their love and generosity - but in a way different than you wished.   Perhaps just accepting that their ways are different &  graciously and non-judgementally accepting their gifts in the spirit they were given would garner better feelings for you.   I don't imagine they intended to insult you.

And re the stuffed toys - we ended up with tons of them too - but I would say they did have good play value for our kids - they engaged in lots of great imaginative play with their 'stuffies' .

Agnieska, how old are your kids?  My daughter is 4 and I find that she plays all kinds of pretend games with her toys.  I do think it's too much, and I do worry about the message it's sending her, but at the same time I also see the value in a lot of the ways she learns through using her toys.

I ride in them all the time. Funeral homes use them. Overrated, IMHO. And the front seat is crowded.

Agnie-they really did mean it out of love!

I do remember the time my friend asked for "wood toys" for her children from family. She received some of the kind desired. BBUT her brother choose to misinterpt and got the kids a battery powered toy chain saw. Loud and annoying and the kids ran around with it pretending to chop off legs and arms.-Not the peaceful home my friend desired.

However-as teens and adults now-this experience didn't harm them. They are delightful and kind and sensitive.

I struggled for a while with the 'issue' of other people and there relationship with my kids.  I preferred to avoid candy and junk food and plastic junk toys.  My in laws preferred to feed kids candy and junk food and give them plastic junk toys.  After some difficult times spent together I chose to accept that I couldn't change them - only my own response.

I chose to keep my mouth shut.  The children didn't spend very much time around the in laws.  They all knew my preferences and chose to give the kids things I didn't particularly appreciate - but was polite about.  When a child threw up over the Christmas dinner table  I quietly sympathised and said (loud enough to be heard by the adults) "Sometimes that happens when people eat too much candy and junk".  Slowly over the years things evened out - I got less adamant that I knew best and they learnd more about nutrition and money management.  We remained on friendly terms until death took them away - and yes - my kids missed them desperately for several years.

Well, I watched them as they opened things.  And literally, they picked up one or two small things and started playing, totally ignoring the other 12 things on the ground.  So, they can totally love just one or two and the rest?  not necessary.

I don't know if they would choose zoo OVER toys.  But they also love the zoo and swimming.  They are kids, they want it all!  But that's not possible.  

Yes, the toys are definitely cheaper.  It's just that there are so many people - if they pooled their money there would have been way more than enough for a zoo pass or swimming classes, and then some.  

Well, they don't have to give away all their toys, or the toys they really like.  And amazingly, they are totally okay with it.

No, not trying to be hurtful.  They are just not hearing us.  And we'll have to talk to them again.

The problem I have is the total overkill.  It's crazy to think that Santa would ignore the wish for just one or two things, period, and swamp people with tons of things that aren't needed or wanted!  I hope that this makes sense.  It's one thing not to get what you want - and yes, that sucks - but to get so much that you don't know what to do with?  

See, I think it goes beyond that.  It's not that I wanted necessarily certain types of toys, or brand names, or price ranges.  It was just tooooooo much.  Way way way way way too much.

I have tried that approach in previous years.  Remember,  I had my first 6 years ago.  I have brought home truck loads of toys and things and clothes.  I have given a lot of stuff away, and I have kept stuff out of obligation.  And then I started asking, please, not to much, not that many, please.  To no avail.  

Maybe they don't intend to insult.  But that's what it feels like when you ask directly and are ignored.

And we have tons of them already.  And they kids are attached to the ones they already have.  They really honestly didn't need more.  

Hi Mists,

I find that the "too much" part is actually limiting on the kids imagination.  When you have a toy for every single idea you come up with, it's the imagination is not as engaged as it could be.  My girls are 6 and 4.5) and they do play tons of imaginary games with their stuffies.  But the are playing with the stuffies they've had for a while and are attached to.  The new stuff, it's not as valuable to them and gets thrown into the corner of the room a lot quicker.  

 Ps.  you can see my avatar for evidence of "too much"

See, I question that.  Not whether they love the kids, no.  I question their motivation.  Is it easy to buy cheap stuff?  Is it, well, cheap?  Is it because it's easy to fill a tub of cheap stuff and look like you are oh so giving that way?  I'm sorry if I sound sarcastic, I just CAN'T let it continue to happen.  Or, maybe I'll have to start going form their house straight to the Salvation Army.  

But what is the motivation?  Is it really the kids' best interest in mind?  If so, wouldn't we as the parents be good judges of that?  And didn't we explain loud and clear what we think would be best?

And if it's about love for the kids, then perhaps asking the kids' parents for what they needs is the way to express that love??    That's what I'm thinking

Perhaps having too much stuff doesn't harm the kids in terms of their development.  BUT it harms the planet, it harms the environment, it harms the kids' idea of what's enough and what they actually NEED, it harms their perception of what the world is like.

I have three thoughts that come from your responses:

1) Have you ever asked them why they give what they do?

2) Have you considered having your girls go through their stuff a few weeks before Christmas (and birthdays too) and picking out things that they no longer play with. Maybe they could help you choose a worthy organization that you could donate the still useable toys to.

3) Do your children really want trips to the zoo, swimming lessons, etc.? If they do, maybe they could ask their grandparents for those gifts (it might have more effect if it comes from their mouths). They might have other similar ideas that you hadn't thought of too (a trip to the movie theatre, or a picnic in the park for example). 

and I also wonder what their father feels. It's his family"s giving that has Agnie so riled up. What does he think?

Is this how he was gifted growing up and parents are doing the same thing? Or has some dynamic changed?

Agnie-I'm sure they didn't do it to insult you.

My advice is not to make this a power struggle.

Agnie.

I hear you at some level.  We too found that our kids at about those ages received way too much stuff.  I think part of it stemmed from the fact that many of our family members genuinely enjoyed shopping for a child.  For many years our kids were the only kids at Christmas time and as a result they were inundated and, like you, it bothered me.  However, I also know that the joy of shopping for a child was genuinely appreciated by many in our family.  Like you, I would also agree that there are many less advantaged children who would have benefitted from the purchases.  I also know that for these relatives they loved watching a child open the gift rather than donating it to, say, the Angel Tree.  If it helps, we have found that as the kids got older it calmed down a bit.

Like you we also had a bit of a diplomatic chat about toning it down a bit as well and while it took a Christmas or two to get there....get there we did.  This year each set of grandparents chose one or two gifts for each grandchild.  Still a lot when you add it up, but it seems more reasonable and the kids were just as happy as they were with the years that there were 7 or 8 gifts under the tree.

I also agree with you that this isn't good for the environment and that it also sends the wrong message to your children about Christmas and "stuff".  My only comment would be about the message you want to send your children about relationships and gratitude.  If these family members chose these gifts for your children because they genuinely thought your children would enjoy the gifts then turning around and carting them off to the Sally Ann may send a skewed message to your children about gratitude and the importance of genuine relationships.  We always talk about the notion that relationship are more important that "stuff".  Usually we mean it in reverse of this sort of scenario.  We'd rather have genuine relationships than "stuff".  However, perhaps this is one of those times that we need to turn our thinking around a bit.  These people love and care for these children....and yes, they went overboard (none of us are perfect and sometimes we do things that aren't ideal).  Hopefully they will hear your plea to tone it down a bit.  But, in the meantime, perhaps accepting the gifts, even when the situation frustrates you, sends a message about your value of these relationships to your children.  Gracious and joyful accepting of a gift is an important lesson to learn...even when the gift isn't something you wanted, asked for, expected....or is more than you wanted, asked for or expected.

Case in point.  My mother-in-law loves  garage sales.  If often drives me CRAZY that she returns with boxes of stuff for my kids.  Stuff that we don't want or need and adds to the clutter in my home. The odd time there has been something truly wonderful (i.e lots of good second hand books), but lots of time it is just more stuff.  However, I also know that this is a meaningful way that my mother-in-law tries to do things for her grandchildren. It is one way she shares that she is always thinking of our kids and trying to do things for them.  She lives on a modest budget so this is something that works for her within her budget. She also truly enjoys garage saling and hunting for things that she considers treasures for our kids brings her a great deal of enjoyment.  I can respect that and in the end, the relationship is far more important than the stuff.  We tend to use the things for a while and then either pass them along to someone who might enjoy the things, or like you, they are donated quietly, in a manner that won't offend my mother-in-law.

Hi DaisyJane, 

I hear you about that, I really do.  I just have to underline that I see no problem with a child opening one gift from one auntie's family instead of opening two from each member of that family, do you know what I mean?  I am not trying to rob my kids and relatives of that experience.  It's just gone over the top.  

And this is where my relatives let us down.  We asked clearly.  And we were not heard.

Not at all.  We had a conversation about being grateful for the gifts and also that we do not need all of them but others do.  I am not carting things off to the garbage bin because I'm too good for it.  We are talking boxes of things that we have no space or need or want for.  

Well, perhaps this is the approach that works for you.  I'm sorry but it feels a bit like I'm being preached at.  And told that I am not being "graciously and joyfully accepting".  Yes, it is important.  AND we had to leave things behind because there was NO space in the van.  I, for one, found it very hard to be graciously and joyfully accepting of the gifts when I found myself unable to fit everything in the VAN.  

What is the lesson to learn here?  I sure hope it is not "lie about how you feel" about what just happened.  Is that what you mean by "gracious"?  I'm afraid I just don't agree.  I was floored.  

Look, I don't disagree with you.  The relationship is more important.  But in the scenario you are describing, it sounds like a very one-sided relationship.  And like you are patronizing your mother-in-law by not being honest with her. 

 Ps.  Please feel free to call me Nishy if that's easier for you.  Thanks

For those on the other end - the grandparents for instance - who want to give something to their grandchildren I find that asking the parent what is wanted, needed appropriate helps.  We only have two - we got grandson a small to mid sized lego set because we knew he wanted it - his mom told us he wanted a fluffy robe to put on after his bath (something I never would have guessed for a six-year-old boy) and he needed a sled. 

An almost 14 year old girl is harder to shop for.  Mom told us she wanted sweats and a hoodie in her school colours and with the school lego - so we ordered that.  And a new game for the family Wii they recently received (from Seelerboy - the kid's uncle).    I would never try to buy clothes for a teenager.  The other grandmother got her a gift certificate for a popular young people's store at the mall and she went out a few days after Christmas and got two pair of jeans on sale.   For her birthday coming up soon we plan to give her money for her class trip when they complete middle school this spring.

 Is that too much?   It's a heck of a lot more than we were able to give our kids 30 years ago and more than we would have dreamed of when we were kids.

 Agnieska,

 I really related to your frustration even though I don't have kids.  I've gone through the same sort of thing with other members of my family relating to the amount of gifts and types of gifts. My sister who has a son has gone through it as well.    I don't think you're not being gracious nor recognizing the intent behind the gifts.   It's wasn't about that for me, or my sister.  Walking the line and struggling with that part is hard, especially with Mom.    I know the joy Mom gets from finding things and buying things for us and her Grandson and it wasn't trying to quell that at all.  She also has a thing for pretty and beautiful things.

I like pretty and beautiful things.  I have a lot of things that sit there and look pretty and beautiful and that's it.   It got the point though when I simply ran out of room.  Couple that with a general ethos of living more simply and paring down and it got really hard.   I remember one Christmas coming home with the trunk loaded and half the back seat filled with more then half it stuff I would never use or that wouldn't do anything but take up space.    One relative gave me this floor statue which was really cool but I quite literally had no place to put it.   I liked it and completely appreciated it because it did fit 'me',  but seriously where was it going to go?  And it wasn't a matter of just removing something and replacing it because the only somethings I could remove were also gifts at one time.  So my choices were get rid of a gift I already liked or find a place to store one or the other and change them back and forth.   Something I already did to some extent because of space issues, but over the years those things were starting to add up in the amount of storage space they needed.    So it was about clutter in the line of sight, growing issues of clutter out of sight and struggling to give up things and gifts to deal with it.   Something had to change because it was starting to affect the joy of giving whether it was getting or giving and if it kept going on the same way it was literally going to add up as the years went by.

     So a number of years ago my sister and I got together and started sending out the message to everyone, please no more knick knacky things and replacing it with beautiful and useful with useful being the key word.  Even better, consumable.    I suppose it might sound harsh to some and dictating but it wasn't just a principle thing but a practical one.     I only have so much room, especially for things that are just decorative.  A lot of things would just end up staying in their boxes or get shoved in the back of a cupboard due to sheer lack of space.  I'd feel guilty about.  I'd stress about it and then have to go through the struggle of deciding what to get rid of when a purge was needed.  Hard to do at times when things are a originally gifts.     We also have pushed the basic principle of quality over quantity and we were even okay with second things.  

  It took a number of years to change the general ethos, partly it was respectfully talking about it and partly it was reflecting those values in gifts we give.   I hadn't really thought about much until this thread because it has changed.   Taking account of this years gifts...  I gave most everyone handmade pottery travel mugs for the car.  Very beautiful and useful.  I also gave some handmade leather journals to the writers.   They're art pieces in and of themselves.   I got, lots of gourmet spices,  tea, coffee, a couple of pieces of clothing, a pair of really good winter socks, a high quality mini muffin tray, bath salts, a gorgeous necklace, some really nice sweets and a hand sewn cloth shopping bag which is beautiful.    All great, all beautiful and all really useful.  Nothing is going to sit around and do nothing.   Mom still goes crazy with gifts, that will never change,  but she now gets different types of things which is great for her and great for us.  Win, win.

My sister of course has also had to deal with gifts for her son and has gently passed the message on to the relatives about going crazy about it.  I can relate to that urge I get it myself when I look for gifts for him.  I see dozens of things I'd know he'd like or think are cool.   They are really good at passing on suggestions and very specific desires.   Useful for him is defined differently of course but she has managed to steer things in a direction of quality vs quantity citing both economics, views on materialism and ecological concerns.    She is trying to instill values around those things with her son and I don't think it's wrong to share those with others and ask for respect along those lines. 

Sorry Nishy. I didn't mean to sound preachy, though I can see how it comes across that way.  I suppose my only thought was that if I had purchased some gifts for someone and then found out later they had almost immediately been passed on I might be hurt....and do you want to risk that within the context of these relationships.  I get the fact that it is too much and I get the fact that you have talked to them.  We had to have the conversation a few times before it sunk in.....that whole Christmas excitement and tendency to go overboard thing.

In those early years of "too much stuff", we found it helped a lot to do our shopping together for each other's children.  It became an annual tradition to get together early in November and go shopping.   The moms went to the mall and out for lunch, and the dads and kids hung out at someone's house. 

Wow, that's a great idea paradox3!

I would not be insulted over Christmas gifts.

While you are obvoiusly trying to control their behaviour , we don't control the behaviour of others, only our own.

They like to buy gifts for grandchildren.  Most grandparents do and enjoy the idea of special treats.  My dad never visited without a box of smarties.  not a huge deal except he saw my brothers kids almost daily at times.  They asked him to tone it down but it was something he adored doing and something he never had as a child having been very poor when young.

There are reasons people do things.  Those reasons are valid.

You are mad and to me , unreasonably so.  You asked them to do something and for them perhaps they have toned it down from what they wished to do.  Perhaps their tradition has been to give like this.

When I was a child we opened a mountain of gifts.  Hundreds.  now most of what my mother wrapped for us were things we needed, socks, underwear, books, ......  but also toys.  My parents had very poor background and I guess loved the idea of so many gifts to open.

When my oldest brother had kids they established quite a good idea with my parents.  Grandparents always wonder what to give.  They asked them for a new snowsuit /boots annually.  Obviously the money was sent in November but it was always from grandma and grandpa.  Sometimes they arranged a trip to go shopping together.  That then made Christmas slightly less gifts.

You can't control them and I dont' think you should .

i would not give away gifts that were just given but i would talk to your children about what old toys they can give away to make room.

And next year  realise they have a style of giving that they do . Others will always treat your children differently than you do and it is out of your control.

Agnieszka, you came on pretty strong with your dismay over the gifts.  I think Daisy Jane was not preaching, but was quite reasonable to offer another perspective.  I agree with her.  There are places to be patronizing - when it really doesn't amount to much, and times to be honest.  Honesty would be about safety & welfare & morality; but not the fun of garage sales & traditions, I don't think.  at least in the contexts we've all been describing.

My inlaws who have plenty of money and apparently brains, often purchased the walmart version of the good toys, and usually bought things that were too old for the kids.  A finicky trainset for a 2 year old.   A magnet science set for a 3 year old.  and so on.  They might buy one thing we asked for but a crappy version, and then a pile of other things unnecessary.

I grew up with lots of trinkets under the tree - I didn't appreciate them all at once, but found ways to love them as days went by.  Nice to discover something interesting in the days after Christmas when the rush wore off. 

I think there are different traditions at play here, and we can roll our eyes at them and choose different traditions, but it always helps to remember that I can only change myself & my own path, and others are grown-ups - able to make their own choices and rationalize their own things.  I think it is reasonable to provide a list when asked for, but nothing beyond that.  

We teach our children in our homes about materialism and being green and what really matters.  Then our chidlren learn about the rest of the world, and the other people who love them and make the world go round when we visit & interact with them.  We can't control the rest of the world, but we have to teach our kids to appreciate others and make their own decisions. 

I might sound like I'm preaching, but that would only be the case if I was in a 'higher' position than you.  I understand your frustration when people seem to ignore you.  That is a bigger issue that a Christmas loaded with goodies.  But in my experience, what was important was teaching my kids that people are different, and how to be loving & grateful but make their own choices. 

And after every Christmas where toys were the big thing, I had a day of packing up the old, and sending it to the Sally Ann.  It became a bit of a tradition, and I let them keep nearly all their new stuff - unless we had duplicates or they really didn't want something.  It was their way to remember the people who care about them. 

One thought that occured to me while reading this....are you most angry about the stuff or about the fact that they didn't listen to your request?  It sounds like the latter.

and if it is a regular thing, I'd be mad too.

Yes, I suppose that was my question Birthstone.  Is this about the stuff or something else?