Globo's picture

Globo

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Consumerism and relationship with God

I know there are a lot of critics of "consumerism" in religion, but their solution, which is usually some version of "my way is the one right way to be faithful- stop being so self-centred" is not helpful to me. The flip side of consumerism as selfishness is empowerment.

Critics who say the younger generations are too self-centred, thus refuse to submit to the will of God (or any other so-called representative of God), still equate "control-over" as how ideally our relationship with God should be. Like it or not, I think consumerism mentality has shifted our way of relating to other people and by extension, how we would like to relate to God.

If it's completely made into an economic model- I give you this for that, and will only give to you when I get-  I agree that that kind of relationship is soul-destroying and destructive to society. But I see hope for consumerism in transforming a control-over hierachical norm into a society which recognizes the value and power of every individual. And our relationship with the Ultimate Power is where we feel the full acceptance of our uniqueness and are strengthened to do God's will, which is establishing the Kingdom.

How do you see consumerism affecting faith?

 

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RAN's picture

RAN

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Not everyone is equally able to consume, whether because of wealth, health, or something else, so I would see an emphasis on consumerism as favouring unequal relationships, not opposing them. What would be the value of the destitute, the terminally ill, the seniors in long-term care, if value was defined as the ability to consume?

 

 

MikePaterson's picture

MikePaterson

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Consumerism is never enough.

 

Faith is its opposite.

not4prophet's picture

not4prophet

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Where did you get the idea we were to establish the Kingdom? The only kingdom mankind has ever established is one suited to his/her own wants .. and that includes in religion.

Arminius's picture

Arminius

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Consumerism doesn't fit into my faith.

kaythecurler's picture

kaythecurler

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It seems to me that having an interest in consuming is a distraction (though we do need to purchase food and have housing and clothes!).  It takes our focus away from relationships.  It uses the available money in ways that don't provide a real benefit to others.  When we spend time thinking and yearning for the next advertised item we want to buy we aren't being gratefuk for our life and the gifts within it.

GeoFee's picture

GeoFee

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In my lifetime, 1950 till now, the word Citizen has been almost wholly eclipsed by the word Consumer. Listening to the popular discourse you will be hard pressed to find reference to being a Citizen, with all it entails.

 

George

ninjafaery's picture

ninjafaery

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Countries are "economies" now. Citizens are "Tax payers". Zero trickle down or investment in a strong, social safety net. Folks, in case you missed it, we're screwed.

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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Globo,

 

consumerism is deeply soulful, uplifting, part of the divine dance, enticing people closer to g_d and agape...

 

See video

John Wilson's picture

John Wilson

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Hmmm. First time ever, Your post. I couldn't get your Howard bloom, He ;ooked st me, but wouldn't move. . Dang! 

MY infantile understanding is that consumerism is merely  understanding  what consumers want and compete in producing what they want the most; a good thing...

For business

and for Religion(s)

and why wimmin dress pretty (Ducking and running)

 

 

Dcn. Jae's picture

Dcn. Jae

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Consumerism affects faith and I don't like the way it works with the Pharisees and priests of the world.

John Wilson's picture

John Wilson

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Dcn. Jae wrote:
Consumerism affects faith and I don't like the way it works with the Pharisees and priests of the world.

In what way does it so work?

Giving the people what they want rather than what they should be told? What?

And

 

Don't most things affect faith?

 

Interested in your view,,,

Cheers!

 

Dcn. Jae's picture

Dcn. Jae

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Happy Genius wrote:

Dcn. Jae wrote:
Consumerism affects faith and I don't like the way it works with the Pharisees and priests of the world.

In what way does it so work?

Giving the people what they want rather than what they should be told? What?

And

 

Don't most things affect faith?

 

Interested in your view,,,

Cheers!

 

Happy Genius, consumerism works by asking the question is what you want to get the best thing that you can find. In other words, are material goods really bad for you and yours or something that will allow you to get up in the morning and then use the information contained in the city and county seat to say goodbye to someone who doesn't care about your feelings and emotions that you have. These questions pertain to the public domain and I will never forget how much they mean to me.

John Wilson's picture

John Wilson

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Dcn. Jae wrote:
Happy Genius wrote:

Dcn. Jae wrote:
Consumerism affects faith and I don't like the way it works with the Pharisees and priests of the world.

In what way does it so work?

Giving the people what they want rather than what they should be told? What?

And

 

Don't most things affect faith?

 

Interested in your view,,,

Cheers!

 

Happy Genius, consumerism works by asking the question is what you want to get the best thing that you can find. In other words, are material goods really bad for you and yours or something that will allow you to get up in the morning and then use the information contained in the city and county seat to say goodbye to someone who doesn't care about your feelings and emotions that you have. These questions pertain to the public domain and I will never forget how much they mean to me.

 

I am sorry but I simply do not understand your conjusction of possestion of material goods

and information in the city and county seat...conjoined with saying goodbye...

Is this your way of water-bouy imitation? smiley

WaterBuoy's picture

WaterBuoy

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"Folks, in case you missed it, we're screwed."

 

An impression from HG? Contrary to empowerment ... when power corrupts? Is power within the kingdom? Then most of the citizens are on the outside ... shunned if they speak of mythical wisdom on justice ... classic stuff ... even aboriginal in regards to concept that the earth is not to be conquered ... but assisted with a bit of cultivation ... could be an infinite metaphor ... like G~D ... sort of an out-there conception, vergen with emotions at the margin or far medi-OEMs!

 

The shunned are to be kept unbalanced ... if they were balanced they'd know how they were being screwed ... in a hazing of cloud of unknowing ... who would care? Deficiencies in knowledge, intellect and wisdom can be catastrophic ... creating edges and means to falling off that tier ... is there anything below? That could be sublime humur for the superficial mind that loves to see wee people destoyed in the Circe ... no outside the Circe ... reciprocation of the kingdom thing ... an upset theory. Sort of like the image on tha back of the eye righted in the brain? Left mind theosophy; the reversal of observations can cause come-backs or egos ... which many hate as being close to cognizant ...! Don't goth-Eire ...

 

Is this something to aspire to or shrink from as if humbled by the bloodlust of busy men? Business as usual folks ... the process of advocating ends in innocence of knowing better! Sometimes known as conspiracy of ignorance ... then busy people would accuse me of being a conspiracist so they could project their errors on me ... mission accomplished! Everybody else must be wrong but those that are too busy to think ... numinous in the light that surpassed eMe ... sort of like reflexion on history and how it repeats ... a type of literary resurrection as bent in mental dimensions?

 

There's a device to make you think ... if you could see behind the abstracts ... dark words as Shadow on the pageboy ... yeoman? The bull rushes as papy-ruse ... Egyption cryptology tasking information age away from what cast in stone? Now that's some evolution!

MikePaterson's picture

MikePaterson

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Consumerism promotes inner hungers that can never be satisfied. 

 

Faith satisfies hungers we may not recognise, but which debilitate us nonetheless.

 

Consumerism appropriates; faith gives.

 

Consumerism enslaves; faith liberates.

 

Consumerism engenders fear, faith's essence is fearlessness.

 

Consumerism destroys, faith creates.

 

 

And so it goes

 

… everybody knows.

 

WaterBuoy's picture

WaterBuoy

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Faith creates a hunger to wonder about what's hidden in the haze of emotions and how to get out of such a hard spot ... the overhead view of the upstanding "I" is capital ... just a period, denoting the beginning of another statement as the story goes on ... no end tuit, goes round! Sort of like coming back atchi ...

not4prophet's picture

not4prophet

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When it comes to giving of oneself, which side of the fence does consumerism fall on? Does consumerism promote freely giving of oneself or for a price? Which is of the Kingdom and which is of mankind?

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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in 2013, bits of g_d got together to engage in fearless, giving soulful liberation, to always connect

 

here are* some of what happened

 

endless variety of people helping each other be co-creators

See video

some of the perhaps lesser-known entities brought up in the above talk are:

zipcar
airbnb
blablacar
fiverr
etsy
topcoder
buzzcar
 

 

meaningful content that matters

See video

 

(for those who are wondering aboot the young man who died, here is the link; be prepared to cry -- i did within the first 30 seconds...)

 

those are only two of the presentations.  do check out the other ones.

 

heaven on earth!

a-men!

a-woman!

a-other!

 

*

See video

John Wilson's picture

John Wilson

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MikePaterson wrote:

Consumerism promotes inner hungers that can never be satisfied.

 

 

 

Wow! I don't think I've ever had one of THOSE! 

Obviously I know nothing about comsumerism.. Google here I come...

 

======LATER===='

Ok, purchasing things in ever increasing amounts.., is a bad thing.

Not as bad and losing your job or diminishing you income. That surely leads to ever diminishing amounts. A bad thing...

So we're searching for the middle ground... 

 

(Hmmm 'inner hungers'?) 

 

MikePaterson wrote:

 

Faith satisfies hungers we may not recognise,...

 

 

Non recognized inner hungers...satisfied by faith.?

 

Having little if any faith, and less knowledge (I stumbled over "Productionist" when getting all the definitions of Consumerism)...I can't follow you here...

 

MikePaterson wrote:

 

but which debilitate us nonetheless.

 

 

A satified inner humger that we dont recognize can debilitate us?

 

Holy, mother of pearl! So THAT's why I no longer do the 100 yard dash.

(My Ignorance had to be met with a try humour)

 

MikePaterson wrote:

 

Consumerism appropriates; faith gives.

 

 

It's amazing when I try to count the ways in which I don't understand those four words...

 

MikePaterson wrote:
 

 

Consumerism enslaves; faith liberates.

 

 

Faith is a controling mechasism. Church going is a way to escape reality.

Consumerism keeps you from starving.

 

(For all I know...    BTW this is the first post of yours I didn't go away strongly feeling that I learned something.) Learning that I am ignorant IS a step up, no?

 

 

Kimmio's picture

Kimmio

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I think what Mike's getting at is that the constant focus of advertisers to sell us stuff gets us addicted (or tries to) to accumulating more stuff- products not made to last- gotta have that new gadget, even though the last one works just fine- err, except it was built to last only until the 1 yr warranty runs out, or something like that. I got this mp3player dock- a stereo speaker thingy that you plug a (brand name) mp3player into to play music- 2 yrs ago for Christmas. The mp3player is about 5 yrs old- another gift from a family member who likes to keep up with technology (we don't buy it-it's conenient but I'd still be perfectly happy with a 80's walkman and a record player- but the cassettes are really hard to find and records get scratched- heck, I'd be ecstatic if instead we all had jam sessions in our living rooms!) the version of the dock I have would not be compatible with new mp3players because they use a different shaped jack - so they make new docks. That's the only difference, but companies make these types of insignificant changes to their products to keep us hooked on buying more. In the process, they use more metals, more plastic (including the packaging). Why? To make more money is all. Who cares if we run out of everything we need to survive? Piles and piles of stuff filling up landfills. Pollution, depletion of natural resources. Meh, we got new mp3players! Oh, the frenzy people get into because they make next years model into a rainbow of colours! Gotta have one now! Not me. It really bothers me what a short 'life span' products have, and what a short attention span society has for products more than a year old. Meanwhile, the people in the factories making them probably can't afford to buy them- if they can even afford the basics- and yet, they depend on those jobs because it's all they've got even if it doesn't pay them a living wage and the CEOs are super rich. But, oh the colours! Gotta have them. Eye crack.

I get Mike's point. I wouldn't have spent my money on that stereo dock. In fact, I didn't want to be rude because it was a gift, but a year later I tried to sell it and put the money towards some things we needed- but it was already obsolete. Investing in life is more important than investing in stuff.

John Wilson's picture

John Wilson

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WaterBuoy wrote:

"Folks, in case you missed it, we're screwed."

 

An impression from HG?

 

 

I give THAT impression? 

 

 

WaterBuoy wrote:

 

Contrary to empowerment ... when power corrupts? Is power within the kingdom? 

 

 

Power not only corrupts (eventually) but it requires responsibilities and work...

I've pretty much kept myself pretty powerless...

 

Being within,  kingdom power is neither nessesary nor needed.(So I'm told)

 

WaterBuoy wrote:

 

Then most of the citizens are on the outside ...

 

yep

 

 

WaterBuoy wrote:

 

shunned if they speak of mythical wisdom on justice

 

 

not so

 

WaterBuoy wrote:

 

 ... classic stuff ...

 

 

There is no such thing. There is classical music, beauty, er cetera.

but "stuff" is...like...the stuff I have stacks of in my den...

You believe in mythical wisdom? Bah, that's just a myth.

 

WaterBuoy wrote:

 

aboriginal  concept that the earth is not to be conquered ... but assisted

 

 

 

A concept by conquered people, no?

 

WaterBuoy wrote:

 

The shunned are to be kept unbalanced ... if they were balanced they'd know how they were being screwed ...

 

How exactly do you uunbalance a shunnee?

 

Is it a problem? Is it your problem, or another group of people...the screwedees.

 

Hold it.

 

Here it comes.

 

 

 

 

Is this something to aspire to or shrink from

 

 

YOU DONT KNOW? THE THINGS YOU TALK ABOUT Y O U D O N T K N O W ?

 

Well, there goes 76 hours  of Water Boarding...

 

(Toss)

 

""SPLASH""

 

There.

What's New?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dcn. Jae's picture

Dcn. Jae

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Happy Genius wrote:

Dcn. Jae wrote:
Happy Genius wrote:

Dcn. Jae wrote:
Consumerism affects faith and I don't like the way it works with the Pharisees and priests of the world.

In what way does it so work?

Giving the people what they want rather than what they should be told? What?

And

 

Don't most things affect faith?

 

Interested in your view,,,

Cheers!

 

Happy Genius, consumerism works by asking the question is what you want to get the best thing that you can find. In other words, are material goods really bad for you and yours or something that will allow you to get up in the morning and then use the information contained in the city and county seat to say goodbye to someone who doesn't care about your feelings and emotions that you have. These questions pertain to the public domain and I will never forget how much they mean to me.

 

I am sorry but I simply do not understand your conjusction of possestion of material goods

and information in the city and county seat...conjoined with saying goodbye...

Is this your way of water-bouy imitation? smiley

The city and the other way around the world are the best way back home for a few weeks of school in the morning. As for imitating water-buoy, could any of us accomplish that. Water-buoy is a genius and I don't want to be able to do what he does. My hat is off to him because he is so good at being heard in his own words.

unsafe's picture

unsafe

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Consumerism is all about stuff

 

this is what God's word says about stuff we aquire ----money buys our stuff ---some great advice here -----

 

 

Matthew 6:19-24

New International Version (NIV)

Treasures in Heaven(A)

 

19 Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth,(B) where moths and vermin destroy,(C) and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven,(D)where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal.(E) 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.(F)

 

22 “The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are healthy,[a] your whole body will be full of light. 23 But if your eyes are unhealthy,[b] your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!

 

24 No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.(G)

 

Peace 

WaterBuoy's picture

WaterBuoy

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Once you crap out the consumerism ...

 

Does that leave one un-Sikh'd? Thus you're gone ... and the ass is seen drifting off ... Ba'aL'm tale ...

 

One is a humbled chit of heaven ... just a wee spot ... damned dot? Isn't that a door able to open ... the place to no-man's land is within Urs ... a place not to be rejected as God given Eire spot one must eventually face in a mind blown incident ... an inertial spot that we're in ... something to be left in a cloud of misunderstanding as some of the fallen didn't wish to know! There are ethereal exceptions ... sort of an ayre story ... like samson running amuck rye on the head ... over balled/Ba'aL'd? Just out of this sphere ... and Buddhai was dong'd ...

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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we are all natural prophets, we are very good at it, it's an innate ability

MikePaterson's picture

MikePaterson

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That's well chosen scripture, Unsafe.

 

 

Dcn. Jae's picture

Dcn. Jae

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The question of our times and places and the other hand is that of a consensual act of kindness and I will try to make money by asking them to be able to make money from my nap. When you think about it, the best way to get some sleep tonight in their respective countries that are used in conjunction of your resume is not responsible for any reason whatsoever. People who are interested in going to the mall and then using money to pay for their children who are willing to pay for your support that you can't change should be made to have some fun today and tomorrow.

Dcn. Jae's picture

Dcn. Jae

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Moreover, the time has come to become more popular and then use that information to help kids get a good idea. Consumerism affects your personal information and resources and I don't want to be able to find something better than a decade. Anyone who wants to get some food from the movie is so cute because the corporations simply won't make it happen. Today is the best friend of yours if you want to make it happen. Friend, forget consumerism because it is not the best way to get some good music. Focus on being the best friend of mine and I will never forget how you feel about the teachings.

ninjafaery's picture

ninjafaery

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Dcn. Jae. Have you become a bot???

InannaWhimsey's picture

InannaWhimsey

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ninjafaery wrote:

Dcn. Jae. Have you become a bot???

 

Sorry there -- i was overextending myself in this heat and didn't know what I was doing to the poor man.

 

There.  Control released.

Kimmio's picture

Kimmio

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Lol.

WaterBuoy's picture

WaterBuoy

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Now he is an Eris a dissonance that's out there ... free soul, or something still attached to something that's doubtful?

John Wilson's picture

John Wilson

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InannaWhimsey wrote:

ninjafaery wrote:

Dcn. Jae. Have you become a bot???

 

Sorry there -- i was overextending myself in this heat and didn't know what I was doing to the poor man.

 

There.  Control released.

Whew! (Taking off tin hat) Be careful! That Control bounces around,,,,

 

ninjafaery's picture

ninjafaery

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ninjafaery's picture

ninjafaery

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Reminds me. Christmas in July -- just for you, M'dears.

See video
Dcn. Jae's picture

Dcn. Jae

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Control is a consumerist paradigm. If one seeks to control another, how long will it be before the game is played. When one considers the Pharisees and priests of the world, one must ask just how much the only thing that is not the only thing is the only way. Friends, lift up your phone calls and texts and then use them to be able to make money online.

not4prophet's picture

not4prophet

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Detroit is a perfect example of what consumerism will leave behind in the world.

 

 

John Wilson's picture

John Wilson

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Dcn. Jae wrote:
Moreover, the time has come to become more popular and then use that information to help kids get a good idea. Consumerism affects your personal information and resources and I don't want to be able to find something better than a decade. Anyone who wants to get some food from the movie is so cute because the corporations simply won't make it happen. Today is the best friend of yours if you want to make it happen. Friend, forget consumerism because it is not the best way to get some good music. Focus on being the best friend of mine and I will never forget how you feel about the teachings.

 

I am beginning to see that you are bemired by solipsism and non sequiturs; don't read posts to you with any understanding (or interest) or any real desire to respond intelligently.

 

Strange, but do as thou will.

 

   

WaterBuoy's picture

WaterBuoy

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HG

Truth is not allowed in religion --- old christian fathers --- "common people shouldn't know" ... could be incriminating to the subject of the dispatch ... the objective: numinous ends! They were numb until thoughts descended!

 

Did you know that women were burnt as witches for being literate? Also little people, insignificant people to the court ... that learned to read contrary to what the court laid out ... stakes all over the country for the impalers ... and spitting became popular in what was hell to the object of the connection with bar-be-Q'n ... fear of this point is "barrier" to many (bar; in Hebrew) as a rye soul! Stripped of thought by religious orders ... rules?

 

Logos is word, like God an abstract hue. Didn't see it did jah?

 

Not knowing became contageous in time as it is easier than the alien work of Job ... learning about all-that-is ... devil of a thing, Caesar thought! Thinking men ar dangerous ... Caesar and other people of the power that corrupts thoughts ... overblown desires?

 

If you carry to big a flame does the Shadow diminish? Perhaps just ancient humus, or dirty humur ... mire-y? You can get stuck there ...

 

Does the opposing image get just as corrupted ... like an intelligent man without any cares? Nosh-ite ...

 

Ignorance became easier and easier as innocence was put on a pede stall ... like a contained old fart in ancient linguistics! He be pillared tue/too ... be the deathe of meis how stupidity and unfeeling can be worshiped as idée-aL-ism ... close to god behaviour ... blind desires ... not to think?

 

Yet still people don't know of what I speak and don't wish to know ... or they'd do as I did with James Joyce, Charles Dickens and the boble ... work at it ... dell ogoes ...

 

Appears to be as successful as terrorism ... like a soul fearing his ass' end ... the carrier that is about to become that which isn't ... as an icon ... like mêmè in mnemonic order ... a very disturbed outer soul? Such is a myth or that which is beyond us ... sort or subtle in reciprocal form to allow the hiding therof ... humurs ... sort of abstract ... the Shadow of a thinker ... that where he isn't ... sort of like thought in the non-existent psyche --- some authority that believes there is no such thing as the mind ... or contrary to what he knows. Thus he lost it or it was Luce end'd for hymn ...

WaterBuoy's picture

WaterBuoy

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Love's like that, too much of a good think is like an overfilled cup ...

 

It runs over ... creates an awefu; maas ... flow across the tables ... although it could be an analogy ... an/Na being a crude reflection of old salt! People even despise anagrams ... like illuminatii in adequate presentation and font ...

Dcn. Jae's picture

Dcn. Jae

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Happy Genius wrote:

Dcn. Jae wrote:
Moreover, the time has come to become more popular and then use that information to help kids get a good idea. Consumerism affects your personal information and resources and I don't want to be able to find something better than a decade. Anyone who wants to get some food from the movie is so cute because the corporations simply won't make it happen. Today is the best friend of yours if you want to make it happen. Friend, forget consumerism because it is not the best way to get some good music. Focus on being the best friend of mine and I will never forget how you feel about the teachings.

 

I am beginning to see that you are bemired by solipsism and non sequiturs; don't read posts to you with any understanding (or interest) or any real desire to respond intelligently.

 

Strange, but do as thou will.

 

   

Yes, I guess it's fair to say that. Afterall, the thing about me is that I am a big part of the world and I will never forget you are not going to be the same as a whole bunch of people. My friend, don't think less of me if I tell you that you are going to be the first one to talk about the proposed deletion. In time I trust that you are going to get my nails done. I recommend the following to you: walk on the appropriate walkway and then use the information contained to digest the best food. Vittles are never overcooked in your pot so long as they are not authorized to access the internet.

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