There once was a deity named "God",

Whose believers put up a facade,

Claiming they knew Him,

Though chances were grim,

They would end up beating the odds.

Congrats on humour!

But what do I have to lose if I don't beat the odds?

Probably the vain assumption of an afterlife.

And so what if I were wrong?

Then this is the only life we get, and we're all in this together, so we might as well make the most of it.

I am making the most of it.

God sometimes ya just don't come through,

God sometimes ya just don't come through.

Do ya need a woman to care for you?

God sometimes ya just don't come through.

Ooo Hoo!

You make pretty daisies, pretty daisies, love,

I gotta fi-fi fi-hind what yer doin' a-round here, well, what 'cha doin'?

I feel witches burning, gets a little toasty... hey now, what do ya know?

I gotta fi- fi- fi-hind,

where you always go when the wind blows...

(Tori Amos)

By spending a good chunk of every Sunday appealing to a figment of your imagination?  By assuming you get an afterlife?

This is not a recipe for "making the most of it."  This is simply putting waaay too many eggs in an imaginary basket.

GOD

IT is we; we are IT.

We can't comprehend IT without experiencing IT,

But we can experience IT without comprehending IT—

For we are IT!

IT reveals everything;

IT explains nothing.

The interpretations

Of ITs revelations

Are our creations. 

-Arminius

The Christian message I get from church and from some people at WC has helped make me a better person I believe.  I live in close quarters with my son (atheist), daughter-in-law (no interest in organized religion) and grand daughter.  We get along fine.

It has helped at work too.  I needed that help, maybe you didn't.  I would call my philosophy Libertarian -- live and let live.

It is said that one can't see the w'ole thing until stepping outside one's elphe .. isn't that a w'oly experience sending prickles up des pine?

OBI!

Now are we part of our offspring? Tell me; will we like the heritage left? Now there's an afterlife to encompass in thought ... the intellect that surrounds bode an will (Webster triad)! You just can't see when engulfed in the flames of willies ... relax such pas'Zion will pas ... become beyond yah as being ... soomething lost in relief as in shunned? Thats' the Modern Christian Philosophy of Learning if you don't know the law ... there's no sin tuit! The other's ID of the Wahl?

You're honour ... I din't know! Is that excuse, intellect or ignorance? Yha got tae love infinite hue Moor ... Divine Comedy ... beyond the mortal ... power of myth?

Atheist------The Bible, A Book  atheist say is phoney, or at best. Just a lot of baloney.  -But For 6000 years it has proven to be true. So atheist I say to you. If you believe there is no GOD , and life is just for man.You may  find it is as the BIBLE says.    (-THAT LIFE WAS FOR ,)  THE GREAT  I AM..

Thanks for the laugh.

Do I need a magic decoder ring to read this part?

It's for the soul to be awakened and freed from insane desire to tromp on neigh bore ... the spinning and weaving psyche ... at such vain exhibitions ...

The silent mind just lies there on the page buoy'd ... awaiting additional info ... on how to proceed in the Dark ... that's the Shadow in Tome/Tøom ... some depth encountered with doubt ... so care is required alone with primal desire to goth Eire ...

Metaphor of Cos Moes? The alternate pool  ...

Whether we wish it so or not

Being continues just as it is

Through all its becoming

All its casting off

Its taking on

Energy shaped form

Fully realized

Uncomprehended

Geo.

If Christ drewa line in the sand  (as did others prior) can we step across that into the alternate form? Isn't that just a devil of a thought to those that think of God as emotional ... when those elusive forms can think as well?

Then in Romantic Philosophy ... thinking is bad---the Caesars! They arrested something in humanity ... bought on the Dark Ages ... just peculiarity ... or alien ESS ...

Perhaps that's the way it is with eM ... the paradigm of emotional (spiritual) peoples ...

Great poem, Geo!

I'm not the only philosophical poet, eh?

Was God mentioned in the original poem? I see many of You posters have also been chasing the same You - especially the so-called self-proclaimed "athiests" & "agnostics."

"I keep chasing You and You keep hiding from me"

Ahhhh...you were referring to your dog!  In the "Religion and Faith" forum!  It should have been so obvious to me.

Your dog can whisper your name?  Smart dog.

And why am I a "so-called self-proclaimed" atheist?  Do I not meet some atheist standard?  Do I have to not believe harder?

It seems, Mr. Chanson, you are trying very hard not to believe. Why would an atheist ("so-called" or otherwise!) spend time on a discussion board entitled " Relgion and Faith ?" Hmmmmm...? Try answering that question (without deliberate obtuseness or sarcasm, if you can)!

I enjoy discussing religion and I find faith fascinating.  Doesn't mean I believe it myself.

I'm also a WW2 history buff.  Doesn't mean I want to be shot at.

There once was a poetaster named darrel

Whose views were as straight as an arrow

He's upset we're not attending 

To the things he's reprehending

In his quest for all that is fundamental and narrow

Is it amusing to the spiritual athe -ist to follow all that is said and digest instead of just rejecting experiences ... off the cuff?

In one biblical axiom ... often misread in understanding ..."We should listen to the words of all peoples" ... then some reject as much as they can ... the isolated view in an ol' Hebrew word of mahaineim ... where the devilish mind was laid down east of Canan ... Jack O'bean lad'Ais ... the "i" of the sole in imagination? One should research that word ... imagination! It is similar to irrational nature ... unreal peoples ... mere images in the non-existent psyche?

Those wanderers, hajji-ist ... chuckle at those that can't go there ... fear confines eM! Fear and anger of being aware to the enigma of life as a natural process ... then there is thinking ... an unnatural gah-ost ... the polynesians called eM manna ... another whole story ...

Good one Qwerty!

Darrel, My Tori quote merely came to mind when I read your verse. I have not personally felt that way. Thought you might relate to it.

Thanks Qwerty for the verses!

Elanorgold... the Tori Amos words were interesting but I don't think any god burns witches or anybody, for that matter. People burn people! And they do it in the name of some god/religion. People also wage war, conduct genocide and oppress others in the name of god, or religion, or some ideology. Its enough to make one an atheist! and get very depressed, too. 

No, it's not.  It's enough to make you an anti-theist.  Bad things were done in the name of God in the bible, so if anything, war and genocide today could be argued to be evidence that God is still at work and is still directing the killing.

Ah, God as an infinite love ... a passion that would come between mother and father, husband and wife ... siblings!

Funny thing without intellect, an outside fringe in extreme values that could make a pathological individual. Some variance required! Thus the wobble and weevil about the line ...

Enough to make a theist into a duelist ... or is that deist. Then if one doesn't know the word ... it becomes sacred process of God creating demos unusualy thing here in de mire ... dark humour ... Baccalaureate scéance? Like seeing in the dark, a spark of hope if only humanity would learn from outside experiences (the past and a vision of consequences) ...

Omi Gaw'd there's an outside chance ... quantum thought from a ban'd of intellect? Tis a frothy thing heh ... biers the Shadow ... like PSalm 30: 4, 5 ... joie comes in the morning after awakening ... common sense? IT's a far reach ...

The thing is, when you think there's a god, and you start to think you know what god wants, witches get burnt. God smote plenty of people in the bible. Then one might think that everything that happens is god's will, maybe even that witch hunters are forgiven because they were doing what they thought was right. The whole thing is a tangled disgusting mess and turns me right off religion. People's logic and reason and common decency is regularly shut down by doctrine. You're right, it's people, and it always has been only people doing all human things, inventing gods, inventing god's rules. We should take the responsibility. In my mind, there's no such damn thing as Jehova.

Now I'm sorry if that offends some people, and I think we're all entitled to whatever mental construct makes us feel good and right, so long as we act within the law and don't push that view on others. Maybe I'm pushing my view on others now, or maybe I'm just expressing myself, but the massacres and crimes against humanity and free thought conducted in the name of religion in the past and the present fill me with rage, and I must speak out sometimes.

The human mind doesn't like gaps in it's knowledge, so we fill in those gaps with invention, with myths, stories, gods. We must accept not knowing some things, and I don't think that includes that there might be some sentient, human-like director embedded in the fabric of the universe, who had anything to do with the bible. It's mythology!

How can you only take the parts of the bible that you like and disregard the rest? How can any of it be true in that case? It is symbolic, it represents facets of human nature, and mythologizes some historic geologic events. I am so greatful I was not indoctrinated as a child and that I don't now have to justify the bible with the rest of the world, or shake the rusty fetters it places on people's minds.

Elanorgold, as a bit of chimera (shimmer) you make me giggle ...

Is God a construct of soul/mind/psyche? Why of course like a thought ... just a mere passing ghost ... ethereal thing if you don't believe in the exististance of mind ... that dark storm on the brae'n ... is the emotional side ... casting shadow of doubt.

It appears some balance is required and the story of mind is well projected in biblical (or mythical) construct ... but does mankind wish to know such things? Exodus 20:19 ... cause of weird fallout from heaven ... man(kind) that would rather fight than find some balance in the secondary issue ... psyche? Kind of makes people question and knock on the tree ...

The religious say: don't go there. Then why was the psychic phenomenon created ... if we were not to be aware of such odd and alien things ... learning is such a pain ... sort of like metaphor of the devil!

How best to control creation? Pull the w'ole over their Ais and thus the pall of Rome ... a smokey haze? If we think outside the box ... could we avoid such ends? Then some will believe it is just necessary for them to get the upper hand become god(s) while I'm pleased to be a thinking daemon ... condemned by the court of the church. Thus I'm just a point of thought drifting through the congregation ... studying the state of emotional souls ... mostly devoid hating knowledge and wisdom. I was taught that as a kid: "knowledge and wisdom is bad!" Kinda made me wonder about these people and the health of their psyche as they appeared like raisins ... out there dry in the sun ... Ayres instead of the Celtic Eire ... a wheted soul? That's sharpe eh!

So North Koreans are starving in Kim Jong Il's communist paradise because of .... God?  Religion?  Or because he is a twit, son of man who thought HE was god, but installed by the commies as leader of North Korea after the Korean War?

A Russian Communist joke:

What nationality were Adam and Eve?

Russian, of course. They had nothing to wear, only one apple to eat, and were told it was paradise.

You're right - Kim Jong Il is the son of Kim Il-Sung, the deceased president of North Korea who, even in death, is still regarded as North Korea's "Eternal President", and both he and his son are regarded to be god-like.  So you could argue that religious faith has something to do with the plight of North Korea.

But all I'm pointing out is that the God of the bible is in favour of a little genocide now and then, so when it happens in more modern times, the idea that this same God (if he exists) is somehow against it, is a little presumptuous.

I take from the North Korean story that it is hopeless to try to legislate away religion.   It creeps back in.   Must be encoded in our genes.

North Korea legislated in religion.  They worship the state, and their leaders, both dead and alive.

What about believers in CEILING CAT?

  How u make pic smaller.  Not work fur me.

Black Cat,

Is that not a S' Eire'n thought on non-existant portions of the brae'n (what Webster relates to imagination; the Ais of the sole?). Bit of sooty image of kitty! One has to know a lot of word to get there ... word being like God doesn't have singular, plural, multiple or infinite case ... just is ...

If we don't believe in mind (archaic form of sole/Saul; enlightenment) would chi (the fiery/faer-ais psyche) ignore us? We are sometimes called numb, or is that dome ... sort of warped space in the imaginary Zoan!

Then it says in the bablical concept that mankind didn't wish to know God so we are limited as defined by Paul Johnson In The History of Christianity (as stated): "Christians drew lines of demarkation in the san" (that's without; like a desert feature of the mind ... must be cultivated and mortals don't like a cultivated man ... doesn't fight well). Then san' is hate in an old Judain tongue ... used by the rich and the powerful that were against an enlightened pagan people .. they could be dangerous to whatever's behind the lines ...

Then in occupied France were there resistances to not knowing? Did the same happen in Germany? Who did the powerful west support ... the coine or common people (demos) or the powers  that were ... so beit! Knowledge and wisdom are buried and there has to be another side to the non-existant soul entity ... a single-Ai'd monster ... the imagination? Some phesh'n is required ...

The infinite soul has to be composed of bent space to fit into the mortal ... or could there be outside options? Got cha ... or is that Kitty literally? Running word can do that to Yah ... Os Hite ...

Arminious,

Is the Cyrillic Rush enough to take in the concept of Furies ... Hitler's concept of dah Fueror (spelling varies in alternate tongues) raising a storm of protest about something thoroughly misunderstood by the paradigm. Perhaps this is the Black projection of emotions into intelligent conversation as word on an ancient page (yeoman)? Some transient th'aught required as a space to put IT in ...

Then various authorities have tried to limit the expression of what is huge lesson ... the intellect that is beyond an emotional sort! Modern science struggles with the concept that the thinking process is also outside the bode' of mankind ... does anyone understand "bode"?

How would that mesh with Mathew 28:20 --- "Lo, I am with you always"? An infinite case in a mortal land? There has tobe moor ...

How far reaching is that kind of light? The Einstein stated that space, light and gravity were all related ... equal ... but not quite the same .. there are varients in all things ... thus the soul of God(s) alter! The relief could be expressed as bust ... large bang?

Is that strange, alien, or just downright funny as Cosmological humour ... an outside or OBI perspective? Places me right beside myself and the poorer neighbours say J'aime out of my mind that non-existent point ... of fabric Jammy's? Story for the dark fringe ... s'A'B'D time Torah ... to make one think themselves into oblivion ... hue'd place ... of otherly light ...

CEILING CAT is a pretty decent dude....

There is a person who thinks it odd

To have a belief in a God

It's not really news

That there are various views

From piety all the way to Jihad

LOL! 

I would have thought it was obvious,

That the examples above show a bias.

The rest of us know,

As religious nuts go,

The Jihadists are invariably pious.

Poet show-offs!

Don't mistake this poem as cockiness

I'm just pointing out the blatantly obvious,

And counting beats per line,

While making some rhyme,

Slightly better than our resident Genius.

Okay, that last bit was a littly cocky.

Wow! What a responce for this one! My poetry thread fell comparatively flat! (just me and LB that I recall) I guess it helps to post it in religion!

Some times I'm inspired by others to write poetry, but it happens rarely.  This time, my inspiration was Darrel's poem about his dog.

That's Dog maw ... a dark thing to say the least ... like Lewis' Kitty in the Black Dome of Skye ... intransigant metaphor ... like literal de Vice ...

My apologies for bring Vice on the scene again as a pane into understanding ... a subliminal thing of the devil! Is a thinker devilish in a Romantic trend? But for God's sake don't speak of it clearly ... you'll be nailed ...

I'm not sure, but I think WaterBuoy is being cross with us.

Chanson,

I've often been called disturbed, dislexic and crazy but never really mad at this divine comedy if you just step outside the self and see how it goes ... but you have to act a bit mad so people will leave you in peace. Only crazy people disturb people like me according to psychological theory that say that people that think they are crazy are not and those the think opposing ... are in vert-Egos ... really upset over alien words.

Alien words are the devil you know ... why the Romans tried to burn all old wisdom and reset the type of persona of all creation ... thus upseting history with the ideal-ism of war as utimate. Look up"-ism" in the dictionary ... it is a belief based on faulty logic ... the jar is truly cracked and I hate to admit that I can't escape being part ... truly sadistic in my use of the word --- Joyful Mensa/Happy Genius! (his own analysis of my light situation ... moving, no-mad-ICh?) Ask Arminious about ich and ick ... it'll prick your imagination like Peter's cock crowing ... story of significant depth ... like Tøom in the san ... that without ... or outside reality ... like the eye of imagination!

WB, I don't think I've ever called you crazy.  You're wired differently, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.  You certainly aren't the only member here to take massive liberties with the rules of spelling and grammar to the point that you're difficult to understand, but you are the only one who does it on purpose.

doG:God

What, are dogs more godly than other sentient beings?

One of the Koans (test questions) in Zen Buddhism is: "Does a dog have the Buddha nature?"

Well, I think dogs do, but they don't know it, so they just act naturally.

Maybe that's what makes them so godly, eh?