The controversy is important but not welcomed.  There is another issue going on under the surface - the role of the clergy as a spiritual resource - the understandings of those who want blue - theological or functional? It is a time for a good conversation... yes they are only candles but sometimes they are more.

Well said, George.

I am used to seeing purple in Roman Catholic churches and blue in most Protestant churches. My friend's RC parishes usually use a slightly different hue of purple than their Lent purple. I know that to some friends, a RC priest in blue vestments or using blue candles signals independenceand individualism and not obeying the traditional liturgical colours (5 in RC) and usually signals a not so strict priest... Ask me why the dilemma between blue and purple in the UCC, and I do not know.

Laity often cannot understand the "hidden" symbolism of the ritual or discern for themselves the significance or importance or complete irrelevance of colours if they are not educated of such.

This is where we aid in "creating" dilemmas.

If I were the clergy I wouldn't get into a controversy over candle colours.  I just don't care enough about it to be honest.  I would let the laity use what they wanted but it would be their responsibility to get the candles and place them in the sanctuary. 

It is the challenge to the minister that I find, maybe, is covering a different problem.

Yes and sometimes people really care about the colour of the candles and such.  I'm often amazed but the attention that's paid to liturgical minutia in my church - makes for some long worship committee meetings...

er... let's just make it indigo.

I think this is something to be decided by the worship committee with the minister's guidance.  I prefer purple (a lighter shade than used for lent) with one pink candle for Joy.  I understand that when blue candles are used they should all be blue.  The Christ Candle in the center of the wreath is white. 

But it is not important enough to cause controversy.  I've got a feeling that a minister and worship committee who can't agree on the colour of the candles probably has bigger issues as well.

In my former church we had a problem about where to hang the banners.  One man had made many of them for a particular wall - a new minister suggested that they go up front where they would be more visable.

In my new church we presently have a controversy over a much more serious matter.  Oh, why wasn't I content to just set in the pew and remain unaware of what is going on beneath the surface.

We use blue with a pink candle for Joy sunday -- so they don't all need to be blue!

I like using blue so that Advent and Lent aren't seen as the same kind of preparation periods.

I like the idea of being able to see if an RC priest is a radical by checking out his Advent vestments!  If only we had a similar test for protestants....  :)

After my first Communion in a previous Pastoral Charge, I received a stern talking to from the Clerk of Session because I folded the Communion cloths the wrong way when I uncovered the elements. Apparently I did it left to right when it was supposed to be done right to left and it just wasn't done neatly and delicately enough.

Hearing all this just makes me want to sing along with Harry Chapin

I'm in the dance band on the Titanic
Singin  "Nearer, my God, to Thee"
The iceberg's on the starboard bow
O Won't you dance with me

I am sure ours are purple......I will have to check on Sunday. Seems to me there is pink involved too........

We share with an Anglican congregation, so lately "discussions" about how things are placed in the sanctuary are usually between us and their clergy.

Now I am humming dance band on the tie-tanic............

The minutia usually cloaks much larger "stuff".

As I have said a few thousand times, though we can approach controversy or a mountain made of what we believe to be a mole hill and we can ignore it, laugh at it, be frustrated by it, think it is ridiculous or we can show and seek why it is important. 

I find we usually do the first stuff and far less of the last. I find so much avoidance at all costs. It is difficult having a relationship if there is an atmosphere of avoidance, lack of communication....  We do not have to agree, but -for me- we have to communicate and be able to do so and to do so willingly.

In some places, no matter how objectionable the theology might be, people feel connected because they know. They know why things are the way they are. They know, if for no other reason, than "the priest/bishop/pope...  says so" and that is, for them,  an acceptable answer. For me, that is not good enough and I want to know and church leaders and teachers are there to lead and to teach.... If one is only going to be led, well there are those who require nothing but someone to follow.

Now I know I will get coal for Christmas.

When church officials argue about this stuff, is it just 'such and such is tradition' vs 'I can put up whatever the hell colour candle I want'?

Or does it turn into some sort of far out theological debate over the symbolic significance of the colours?

Because the latter would be REALLY EPIC.

Is not tradition a theological debate we have struggled with and still do struggle with and will likely forever struggle with?

Steven, OCD is a nasty thing, isn't it?

I must confess that there are times when I dearly wish that people would follow my lead because often times when they don't it's more work.  Like when my energy is completely spent from the hours of pastoral care given the previous week to the Mother and two young children who lost their husband/Dad tragically.  And I'm frankly just not up to seeking out the underlying reasons why so and so wants purple candles or why one is bothered that communion napkins aren't folded just so. 

Those are the occasions that I'm short on patience and wish that I don't have to invest a lot of time explaining myself yet again or running to the store  to exchange the purple candles for blue.  Times like those I may just choose to laugh it off , avoid or whatever because I don't have much left to give.

Meredith, I understand that more than you can know on a personal level. I do not, however, get it on a universal level.

I can bet you dollars to donuts you go into most any congregation and they have no idea what colours represent or the history or any of it. It is however it is because it is godly. Someone told them __ colour was the right colour somewhere along the line...

We, universally, live in the shadows of having created a system where clergy were said to be God's representatives and there was a purposeful disconnect between clergy and pew parker and we either bridge that gap or we don't... universally. To do so means that at some point clergy cannot be too tired if that means dumping pastoral care on the congregants or whatever it takes... or they have to delegate the gap bridging to others... or we just keep the status quo.... How's that status quo thing working for us?

I think perhaps of more concern than all this, is the fact that I, a churchgoer of 17 years with perhaps 4-5 off there somewhere in my early-20s, who was confirmed, went to Sunday School, was on committees etc. as a youth rep, did not even realize this was a debate or a discussion. I am familiar that each 'season' has its own colour - Blue for Advent, Green for Pentecost. But I didn't know all the colours - eg, that Purple was a Lenten colour - and while I knew what the candles in the Advent Wreath represented (hope/contemplation/preparation, and joy), I didn't realize that the difference between them being blue or purple was anything other than an availability/'close enough' kind of issue, being similar colours etc.

I think these kind of understandings, while in some ways are trivial litle things, are the kinds of things which can make even involved laity feel at least somewhat removed from church, its symbols, and what they represent. I can see an argument that these things are minutiae and as such don't worry so much and do what you want; but if these things DO represent theological understandings, and something representative of setting the scene for the church in each season, I think those of us who worship could be better helped to understand these things so as to be better equipped to engage in these kinds of discussions, or to dismiss them as yelling over spilled milk.

It appear as though the symbol has become detrimental to the community and therefore the symbol should be rethought, imo...cms

NOt what I see.  I see that there are differences of opinion about the symbol.  I see nothing that says the symbol is the problem.

Of course next year they could use yellow candles for a change, or rainbow candles, or red, or...

In the end the colour isn't the issue IMO.  THe issues is how the colour is chosen and discussion about what people want to say.

GordW - Is the ultimate goal to foster symbol or to foster community?  If the use of a symbol tears apart the community and stands in the way of living out love, then I think that the value of the symbol should be reconsidered...cms

I disagree cjms.  Ithink the symbol is not the issue.  NOte that I said discussion of the symbol (in this case the colour thrreof) needs to happen.   Not to foster the symbol but the symbol is drawing out something else that needs to be discussed.

AS others have said, I strognly doubt the colour of the candles is the real issue--it is at best a presenting point, at worst a red (blue? purple?) herring

Cjms, 

How would you go about "reconsidering" the value of the symbol?  This doesn't sound like an easy process.   

What would happen if the symbol holds deep meaning for some in the congregation, but not for others?

It is the God-Spirit who gifts some to be pastors. As it is His sovereign decision, I do not believe that we need think them as anything other than God-representatives (which is not to imply that they are perfect or infallible).

It was Jesus Himself who gave His disciples the keys-ministry, which I believe has been passed down to current clergy.

Now let us go back to the orginial question - the debate over the color.   This is what is called a teachable moment.  What is really at issue?  There are several unstated problems which this is the surface problem -

If it really is about the color then that too is a teachable moment. What is the meaning of symbols?  To reconsider does not get at the role of symbols is forming the identity of a community.   Are symbols efficacious?  Do they indentify what the nature of the community is?  Thus, the liturgical symbols connect us with a history, they are more than signs but can be an icon that direct us to a deeper level of experience.  The advent candles ( not the color) remind us of journey.  The color connects us with a history - thus blue is one of expectation - the traditional color of Mary as waiting for a birth and the color purple is penitational.  Thus they give two different meanings and focus us on two different ways of living in the in between times, waiting with expectation and the difficult time of birthing something new, or did we come all this way for a birth or a death?

I suggest that the role of symbols is crucial to the type of community we want - some find icons ( symbols) to deepen spiritual experience and others don't - it is an aesthetic choice.

Now some of us want the superficial ( I know that is a judgement) of modern culture and some of us want more smells and bells to suggest a different aesthetic - a difference from the hum drum of life - more color.

PS  O_Sarah -- the Advent Candles traditionally represent the gifts of Hope, Peace, Joy (pink one) and Love.  But those too have been reworked many times!

shalom!

A little  girl was asked why there was a pink candle. She replted ,"We were hoping for a girl". My favorite Advent joke.

DO the color of the candles matter when it really should be about what they represent? Seems a bit legalistic to me to get all bothered about the color of candles.

Maybe the reverends might want to shake things up a bit by using bright, cheerful yellow candles, no matter what time of year.  Or they could use any colour they want.

Fortunately, the old tradition of killing or imprisoning heretics has gone out of fashion.

Ritual without understanding the background and meaning is a futile exercise.  Now, let's all recite the Lord's Prayer ten times in English and in Latin.

If I was a church member I'd like to be informed about the symbolism behind the rituals.  Why don't churches talk about this stuff before it turns into arguments?  It sounds to me as if education within congregations would be a good thing.

Only on Good Friday. For Advent, wear a purple cape. Or should it be blue?

Our problem is the impact of postivistic philosophy - we learned from our society and so much we don't know its impact.   The illustration is the issue of color - it has different levels - from the meaning we asign to it, and that is informed by traditions - like the little girl who said it is going to be a girl - those traditions also have been informed by meaning assigned to the symbol.  However, there is also, at the same time, implicit meaning to the symbol - it is here that positivism blinds us - a symbol goes beyond the objective and calls out a primal response.  Different colors work on the brain and as well have power in themselves.   Even if we are color blind different colors work both on the brain and on our experience - there is intrinsic as well as pragmatic meaning to a symbol and we cannot make it what we want.  When assign new meanings to a symbol it may fight against the meaning asigned, or it can change into a whole new symbol - with a new history. 

Because of the long trajectory of ritual symbols even when we don't know its meaning it still has some effective feelings which may send us out to discover what it means.

Yes we should explain why we do what we do - in the passover there are always questions of why do we do this?  And then an answer is given - we need to do more of this in church.

I looked at our Advent wreath and candles today. We have three purple candles, one pink one and of course the white one in the centre.

I bring my own "stuff" into this conversation. It bugs me to no end that there is all this ritual and all this symbolism every Sunday and hardly any understanding of it. I come from a background of being steeped in knowing why what is done is done and what it means or what it symbolizes or reminds us of.... I value symbolism and feel they can teaches faith matters well.

I understand that there was a disconnect and that without "study" there is much that nobody used ot have a clue about. Thus, to me, when it is not past but is also our present, we keep that power and control --- whether we want it or resent it. Whether it is "I am the minister" or "you are the clergy" and we also create veins of dicontent when we have power struggles, no matter where they happen.... When people do not know, we have pulpit to pew disconnect. I can grasp people not having much information about other faiths. It really saddens me that people have little or no idea about their own.

Talking this week to those around me, I realized that nobody could tell me about vestment colours but clergy and trained lay leaders. Nobody could explain the purple candle, but clergy or trained lay leaders. When asked what the colours mean, "blue is there for Advent, white is for Jesus, pink for joy". That is what they know. When asked "Why purple? Why blue?" Nobody but again clergy and trained lay leaders mentioned royalty or Mary or anything else. It is because it is. When asked why is "Pink for joy?" nobody had a clue.

Yet, these people are the "elders" who were to impart knowledge on to the next generation... It struck me .... That whole generation is missing. My wife and I are it. There are a few younger and so it is important to me that people have that knowledge and can pass along.

I took the time, after asking, to discuss that it used to be that the church had one season, Lent. Seven weeks and seven candles, purple. The rest of the year was the rest of the year. Lent had a colour that was purple for royalty, repentance and suffering and good grief, fasting. On the third Sunday of Lent, instead of solemness there was a twinge of hope or joy to come (resurrection) and that fasting was almost over.... . That Sunday the Pope gave a pink rose to a citizen and preists wore pink vestments. Advent did not always exist, and when it came to be it was thought of as a Lent-ish like season of the Church. Reflect, repent... like Lent and there is that element of hope again. Pink in Advent is joy and also honours Lent. Protestants went blue to distinguish it from Lent and to go easier on the repenting thing.... So, we had a wonderful chat about Roman Catholicism and paganism and I got tons of questions and some that stumped me, I will look into finding out the answers to them and will apss it along. I love learning and learning. When we quit learning, we are dead.

Aquila, I do not deny "call". Call can happen in many ways and be answered in many ways. I was not denying the call to ministry, or context of ordained/ordered/diaconal/lay.... I was speaking more of the history of what I would call systemic or denominational abuse of that call. I mean the purposeful keeping pew sitters in the dark or ignorant as a means of maintaining power and control, done by the Church for the Church, by clergy for clergy, by the powers that be for the powers that be... not for God.

This brings to mind what happened to me last Saturday. I gave the grace at a wedding. Later in the evening a young 30ish woman stopped me and said " What a nice speech you gave. I liked it.". So sad that she didn't know what prayer or grace was.

What else aren't we passing on?

Thanks Clergy Chickita - I just re-learned that this year ... I suspect there was a time I knew that lol, and perhaps it dropped out of mind those few years I was moving around a lot and hadn't really settled into a regular church routine. But I guess that was where my comment came from; while there is so much from my first go-round as a churchgoer that I *do* remember, that this didn't stick with me in any meaningful way tells me that it was obviously not something that was emphasized and shared deeply as a 'ritual with understanding', as someone else called it above. Although I'm also starting to realize there's a lot in terms of symbolism and ritual that my pastor growing up, as great as I thought he was, obviously didn't consider important enough to really explain and enlighten us upon ... and knowing him as I do now as a grownup, as a family friend, I sometimes wonder if he perhaps understood all that himself ... he's probably the main person I know who could be called a pastor without also being at least something of a theologian.

Sunday a little girl was chosen to help the minister with the candle lighting routine.  She wanted to light the pink candle.  It was not 'Joy' Sunday.  A purple candle should have been lite (in our church we use purple), but she wanted to light the pink.  So on peace Sunday we lite the Joy candle. No Sweat!

So have we come to a conclusion of why "joy" is pink (other than that we're hoping for a girl, lol)?

I think with the purple candles people found the theme a bit heavy with repentance, so they added the pink candle for joy to brighten the spirit.  (there is also sometimes a pink candle among the lenten candles).  

Then some churches switched to blue which is a lighter and more cheerful colour than purple - but my understanding was that if you used blue you didn't need to have a pink - the mood was already light.

Advent Wreath

Image: © Mary Fairchild

This is a reason given for blue. Sorry if it is too much reading.

The circle of the wreath reminds us of God Himself, His eternity and endless mercy, which has no beginning or end. The green of the wreath speaks of the hope that we have in God, the hope of newness, of renewal, of eternal life. Candles symbolize the light of God coming into the world through the birth of His son. The four outer candles represent the period of waiting during the four Sundays of Advent, which themselves symbolize the four centuries of waiting between the prophet Malachi and the birth of Christ.

The colors of the candles vary with different traditions, but there are usually three purple or blue candles, corresponding to the sanctuary colors of Advent, and one pink or rose candle. One of the purple candles is lighted the first Sunday of Advent, a Scripture is read, a short devotional or reading is given, and a prayer offered. On subsequent Sundays, previous candles are relighted with an additional one lighted. The pink candle is usually lighted on the third Sunday of Advent. However, different churches or traditions light the pink candle on different Sundays depending on the symbolism used (see above on Colors of Advent).  In Churches that use a Service of the Nativity, it is often lighted on the fourth Sunday of Advent, the final Sunday before Christmas.

The light of the candles itself becomes an important symbol of the season. The light reminds us that Jesus is the light of the world that comes into the darkness of our lives to bring newness, life, and hope. It also reminds us that we are called to be a light to the world as we reflect the light of God's grace to others (Isa 42:6). The progression in the lighting of the candles symbolizes the various aspects of our waiting experience. As the candles are lighted over the four week period, it also symbolizes the darkness of fear and hopelessness receding and the shadows of sin falling away as more and more light is shed into the world. The flame of each new candle reminds the worshippers that something is happening, and that more is yet to come. Finally, the light that has come into the world is plainly visible as the Christ candle is lighted at Christmas, and worshippers rejoice over the fact that the promise of long ago has been realized.

The first candle is traditionally the candle of Expectation or Hope (or in some traditions, Prophecy). This draws attention to the anticipation of the coming of an Anointed One, a Messiah, that weaves its way like a golden thread through Old Testament history. As God’s people were abused by power hungry kings, led astray by self-centered prophets, and lulled into apathy by half-hearted religious leaders, there arose a longing among some for God to raise up a new king who could show them how to be God’s people. They yearned for a return of God’s dynamic presence in their midst.

And so, God revealed to some of the prophets that indeed He would not leave His people without a true Shepherd. While they expected a new earthly king, their expectations fell far short of God’s revelation of Himself in Christ. And yet, the world is not yet fully redeemed.  So, we again with expectation, with hope, await God’s new work in history, the second Advent, in which He will again reveal Himself to the world. And we understand in a profound sense that the best, the highest of our expectations will fall far short of what our Lord’s Second Advent will reveal!

The remaining three candles of Advent may be associated with different aspects of the Advent story in different churches, or even in different years. Usually they are organized around characters or themes as a way to unfold the story and direct attention to the celebrations and worship in the season. So, the sequence for the remaining three Sundays might be Bethlehem, Shepherds, Angels. Or Love, Joy, Peace.  Or John the Baptist, Mary, the Magi. Or the Annunciation, Proclamation, Fulfillment. Whatever sequence is used, the Scripture readings, prayers, lighting of the candles, the participation of worshipers in the service, all are geared to unfolding the story of redemption through God’s grace in the Incarnation.

The third candle, usually for the Third Sunday of Advent, is traditionally Pink or Rose, and symbolizes Joy at the soon Advent of the Christ.  It marks a shift from the more solemn tone of the first two Sundays of Advent that focus on Preparation and Hope, to a more joyous atmosphere of anticipation and expectancy.  Sometimes the colors of the sanctuary and vestments are also changed to Rose for this Sunday. As noted above, in some churches the pink Advent candle is used on the fourth Sunday to mark the joy at the impending Nativity of Jesus.

Whatever sequence is adopted for these Sundays, the theme of Joy can still be the focus for the pink candle. For example, when using the third Sunday to commemorate the visit of the Magi the focus can be on the Joy of worshipping the new found King. Or the Shepherds as the symbol for the third Sunday brings to mind the joy of the proclamation made to them in the fields, and the adoration expressed as they knelt before the Child at the manager. If used on the fourth Sunday of Advent, it can symbolize the Joy in fulfilled hope.

The center candle is white and is called the Christ Candle.  It is traditionally lighted on Christmas Eve or Christmas Day. However, since many Protestant churches do not have services on those days, many light it on the Sunday preceding Christmas, with all five candles continuing to be lighted in services through Epiphany (Jan 6). The central location of the Christ Candle reminds us that the incarnation is the heart of the season, giving light to the world

Like any symbol and ritual, the Advent wreath has a variety of interpretations.

For the last few years I have ignored teh "traditional" HOpe, PEace, Joy, Love thing and created my own set of liturgies (besides for years the order of those things seemd to change when I was young).

I really don't care what coulour gets used.  We use 3 Purple and 1 pink here largely because we have lots of sets of candles bought for us at a close out sale a couple years ago.

I'm loving this thread - it brings insight for those who are wondering about the compexities of the UCC faith.  Ear wax is yellow.

We have lost the sense of mystery ( or Mystery) which symbols & rituals were created to invoke.  We have replaced mystical experience with language.  Now we need education before we can experience it again.

I have always just assumed that the seasonal colours were just the way they were because of an arbitrary decision hundreds of years ago, so they are essentially meaningless for me.  I put red candles in my Advent wreath because it goes better with my room!

A thanks to both ch and stevie.  I want to throw out another idea about the role of symbolism.

As I said we have a postivitist philosophical tradition that denies any transcendent meaning to a symbol - they all become signs, that is literaliistic of some objective experience.

The reason for this turn in understanding is the role of essense or substance thinking.  This is the belief that there is an essense or a substance in every actuality and it is unchanging.  This is found in how we think about the self as if there is an I unchanged through time.  In reality this is not true, there is no unchanged substance but what is is a becoming - perishing.  Again to use the self, we are different and the self is mutable, becomes.

This philosophical turn is carried over to symbols.  We can see it in the understanding of christmas.  Some claim, correctly, it began with the shortness of days, and the waiting for the sun to come, and morfed into pagan festivals of light coming.  This then changed with the christian 'stealing' the symbols of the time and using the idea of light and incarnation - changed it into christmas, and over time that symbol also has changed.  Now the claim that christmas is only a pagan event is to use substance thinking.  Yes the origins are in primal light dark but that has actually been changed, for the symbol is mutable.  We now live in the christian christmas and it may also change in how society sees it, but not meaning if we hold onto our rituals - light and incarnation.  In secular society some of the  symbols are still there but not necessarliy the incarnation aspect.  So we have gift giving - Jesus as a gift but now for some it is only the idea of gratitude.  We have the idea of lighting up the darkness, for some the light of God but for others the hope for more light of peace ( or whatever).  We have the idea of feast and hospitiality - the hospitality of God in the world for somebut not for all.  We can have now  a two track aspect of christmas - the religious ritual and the secular season and we don't have to worry about losing christmas if we ritualize our experience through our symbols.  That is why they are needed.

Now since symbols are history incarnated and mutable it does matter what we do - if we break the habit of the trajectory we lose the history of the idea.  So we must be careful in what we do in iiturgy.  It is fine to change the colors and meaning, for some of the trajectory has attacted itself to the ritual and memory within the church.  However, we also can lose the memory for the mutation has changed the trajectory.

There will be a tension with the old story and the new story and as Stevie points out we need to retell the old to connected it to the new symbol to show how the idea is still being experienced.  In this sense, it is the sense of God that is to be experienced, not as a being, but as lure or aim that is new in each moment, but consistent in its aim.  Thus, in changing the symbol we need to ask how is the past present in the present, and creating the future?

An example is rainbow candles - how to they point beyond themselves to a deeper experience.... to they clash with the other colors of the season?   Is that the only statement we want to make?   It is a good statement but is this the time?

If you have purple stoles etc then purple - if blue than blue - etc.   The pink jumps out and that is good because we are faced with a question of why? I like both ch and strevie in their comments on the pink - it is disquiets us with joy.

In reading many liturgies i find them bland  and not informative.  It may be because the UCC did not have a custom of advent.  In the blue hymn book there are only two hymns, a few more in the red and much more in voices united. I notice though in more voices you have to hunt around to find the index to find hymns for advent.  Since hymns form us you can tell why advent candles and wreaths are still a puzzle and the fact many churches want to sing carols earlier also tells us we want something now and not wait.  This discpline of waiting is good but most of us are like children in the car on a trip - are we there yet?

Advent is one way we can claim christmas and as well let it go in all its secular versions.

Thanks for that, Pan

And pus is yellow-green. Bile can be clear or yellowish.