It's a 2001 Toyota Corolla.  I have loved it, and taken reasonable care of it, but the reality is it is 10 years old, and so, things are starting to go.  Repairing it is often cheaper than a new car; however, the inability to count on it is not a good thing.

So, here is why I thougth I would post this topic.

An investment in a vehicle has multiple facets, many of which are not financial or conveniece.

So, I ask you, have you had to buy a car recently? Have you considered buying a car lately.  Did you faith play a part in your purchase?

I don't yet have an answer, though I have the same problem. I have a 2003 Mazda SUV. It's the most reliable car I have ever owned. It has nothing seriously wrong with it that I know of, and it just recently had a safety inspection. But it has a wide if shallow dent on the side (from a block of ice), the paint is starting to look its age with some rust at the edges, and the mileage is high.

I'm going to get an estimate of the cost of really fixing everything. Then I'll decide.

I'm looking at 

Smart Car -- not sure about a 2-seater, but have a friend who loves hers

Civic

another Corolla, would like a prius ..but really...way too much money, and i dont' drive much

Mazda..never owned one, but people like them.

****************

Also, trying to figure out if I want to spoil myself and buy new...or look for a used car like normal about 2 yrs old....

****

or...can I get away without a car - and in middle size city in s. ontario, -- don't think so....

or .. try to figure out a better cost effective and green solution

 I have a 1998 Nissan Sentra which is starting to show its age.  Its been the best car I've ever owned.  I'm thinking of getting a used Nissan Versa, a friend has one, and they love it.  I've had much better luck, and fewer repair bills, with Nissans than any other brand of vehicle.

Hyundais are quite reliable and low priced.

I am actually seriously considering buying my first car this summer. I am in a unique situation in that I have actually had possession of the car for several years, but it was on loan from the family of the child that I work with - with the condition that I would use it to drive her around (to school, appointments, etc). As long as I have done that, the family has said I can drive it wherever else I want (including some long distance trips). I have paid for all but one of the repairs myself (the tires needed replacing within a couple of months of them lending it to me, so I asked them to split that cost 50/50 with me) but they have paid for the insurance. They recently told me that they were thinking about pulling it off the road to save some money, so I asked if they would consider selling it to me. It's great little car - a 1997 Toyota Tercel. I've already put a couple thousand dollars into it doing minor repairs (I've replaced a few things like the battery and fan belt and had some minor engine problems last year). I'm not sure how much I will offer them for it, but I think I should be able to get a good deal since I have already invested quite a bit in it and will continue to use it to drive their daughter around.

My sweetheart's Smart Car was awesome - I miss it!!  (It was a work car, so not ours to keep)

He drives a Prius now, for 5 years and LOVES it - hasn't cost much for maintenance etc - eg - his front brakes were completely done last week for 500.    It was bought second hand, so its 8 years old and he is still really happy with it.   

We had a mazda and loved it too (old 626 lasted along time)

I think 2nd hand makes the most sense, and have seen many good articles by people in the know who support that.

 Hi Pinga,

My wife and I are also considering new vehicles.

Kimberly is currently in a Mazda 5 which has been extremely reliable and sufficient for our family of six.  She is thinking that she will stay with the Mazda 5 and maybe get a brighter colour.

I'm in a Pontiac Wave which is generally reliable apart from the fact that I was getting Annual recall notices to fix the same problem (Throttle icing) and after three years of separate fixes to the throttle I finally asked if GM really knew what the problem was.  When I got the fourth recall for throttle icing I guessed there would be a fifth and that compliance with the recall was not actually making my vehicle one iota safer.

I'm looking at the Mazda 2.  It is about the same size as my wave.

I suspect that sice the wave is paid off that we will keep it for the kids as they are in the process of getting their licences.

Grace and Peace to you.

John

I usually buy used because of the immediate depreciation that takes place as soon as you drive a new one off the lot. I look for one owner cars with low mileage, that the person has meticulously kept the servicing up to date (usually able to prove with records). And then I continue with following the service guide in the owners manuel to maintain it.

My first concern is safety and now it would include economical too (with the price of gas).  Smooth drive, comfort, resale value, etc.... all come into play.

We went new with our last couple cars, both Hondas. Decided that, for once, we wanted a few years of warranty. Used to buy late model used, though with mixed success.

As for choosing a car, faith comes in as far as choosing a model that is going minimize impact while still getting the job done. I drive a Civic. It's big enough to take on the highway (I find Fits, Smarts, and other econo-boxes don't feel safe on the 400 series) but still has fairly decent mileage and emissions. If I didn't need a highway car, then I'd look at econo-boxes. Our other car is a CR-V (small SUV). We needed a bigger car for family trips, hauling larger loads, etc. and the CR-V offered decent mileage and plenty of safety features. Today, however, those safety features (traction control, stability assist, side airbags) are standard on almost all Hondas except, i think, the Fit.

Pinga mentions Mazda. My company has standardized on the Mazda5 for many of our company cars. Smaller and more green-friendly than the mini-vans we used to use but still has decent cargo capacity for carrying O2 equipment. There is, of course, the 3 which is comparable to the Civic and Corolla. Dad drives Mazda3s a lot and is mostly happy with them.

Mendalla

 Birthstone, I used to drive a Mazda 626 too, it was almost as old as I am!  Now, I drive a Mazda Protege.  I'm a Mazda fan.

 Ok, my "take it for a drive" list is increasing...as is my search list for used....though, i do know that it is so much more cost effective to buy a 2yr old, someday I would love to own something that no one else has driven before.

Birthstone:  I drove a Prius in Milwaukee for a week plus a weekend, and loved it.  It took me a few days to go from, gosh i don't like this car, nothing makes sense to wow, what a nice car to drive.  Actually, that is probably a good reminder as I test drive cars....part of it is your body / habits do adjust.  I have some funny stories re trying to start the prius I will share at another time.

others: my son has driven an old civic and now has a newer civic. he loves it.

judd...they are, but i am driving one now as a hertz rental, and i have driven them in the states, and i'm not that impressed.  I know, the price break is awesome...but, they haven't convinced me.

Phil Edmonston (spelling?) has some used and new car guides in book form.  Or maybe on-line form these days.  One is called the "Lemonade guide to used cars and trucks".  There is also one for new cars etc.  I haven't used those guides in many years so I don't know how good they are now.  I think that there are other guides out there too.

TL

I recommend buying a motorcycle!

 TigerLily, that is what youngestson wants to buy, and tells me about the energy efficiency.  Don't encourage him!.

My sister in law has a smart car and nothing but problems and too small

we bought a used mercedes 230 a few years ago.  fabulous car.  zippy in the city, great mileage adn was wonderful on the highway too.

Great in snow is a big issue for me plus safety.  I am uncomfortable without alot of steel surrounding me.

There's no doubt you can save a bundle by buying a used car. Years ago, I bought a well used Plymouth for two hundred. Drove it to commute some twenty miles to work for two years. Never had repair problems of any significance. I then sold it for 250.

But it's always a gamble.

They advertise one on television that is so savy it can parallel park itself !  (I think it is a Ford Focus-someone correct me if I'm wrong).

I remember reading an article in Reader's Digest years ago about a couple who didn't own a car - their community had a good transit system, they biked a lot or walked when they could.  They rented a vehicle for going on vacations and everyonce in awhile for big shopping expeditions.  They figured in the long run they actually saved when you figure in maintenance, gas, insurance, etc.  Sounds kind of tempting, but I very much like the convenience of my own vehicle.

 Beloved  I am sure it would be healthier and less expensive.  I am not willing to give up the convenience and privilege of jumping in a car.

 Pinga,

I pick up my Mazda 2 on Wednesday. 

Kimberly has decided to wait until next year to get her vehicle.  By then the Mazda 5 will be paid off and she can decide if she wants to stay with a 5 or go to the CX 7 (ultimately it was a choice of colour--she isn't thrilled with the choices for the 5 but loves a colour unique to the 7.

My new 2 will be a very visible green.

Grace and peace to you.

John

 Lastpointe, the resell value of a car that can be safetied is greater than the resell value of one that can't be safetied or driven  and the difference is more than the cost of repair.

John, very good choice in the segment.  Good luck with it, though I doubt you'll need luck.  As I recall, it has been selling in other markets for a couple of years, with good results.

There are fewer "bad" cars for sale these days, compared to just a few years ago.  The "domestic" manufacturers are catching up on features and reliability, the Koreans seem to get better every year, there is still rarely a bad apple from the major Japanese manufacturers, and even the Europeans have picked up on the reliability front.  It's not a bad time to be in the market for a new car.

In the compact area that Pinga seems to be looking at, the one I'd stay away from is the new Chrysler 200, which will probably be another rental fleet staple, at best.  From a driving standpoint, the Mazda3 is probably the class leader.  Of course, nobody ever got fired for buying a Civic or a Carolla, but the new Ford Focus might be worth a look, as it is based on the same underpinnings as the Mazda3.  The Chevy Cruze isn't a bad choice, and neither is the Elantra.  It is very hard to choose a clear leader in the segment.

My main recommendation, is how to buy a new car.  In Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa or Vancouver, I highly recommend the Automobile Protection Association.  (www.apa.ca) and their new car buying service.  The APA is a non-profit organization, and you may have seen them partner with the TV show W5 for used car lot investigations.  Membership costs $65 (or did) and that includes up to three new vehicle pricing reports, complete with pre-arranged deals in the areas serviced by the APA.  Unless you are an experienced negotiator, you will probably not beat these prices, and if you do, it won't be by much.  Basically, it is a pre-arranged fair deal, and it turns the buying process into a pressure-free experience.

I used this service to buy two cars now.  In the first case, I tried to beat the price, shopped it around, and managed to save an additional $100 by driving 100km to Hamilton when we bought our Nissan X-Trail.  My folks then used my membership  to buy their Toyota 4Runner for about $4,000 less than they were quoted from their local dealership.  The APA are great people to talk to, and they will even give you sound car buying advice.  I can not recommend them enough.

 Thanks Chansen.  I will look into them.

I am going to go and sit in each of them and figure out where my purse and coffee will go, when I am alone and when I am with someone. 

I am going to check for blindspots and seating.  I sat in the crz, and tried to backup and did NOT like it.  I really liked the prius for backup and visibility.

I am going to see where you can tuck a pair of glasses, or two.

Funny, I can see price and all the reviews etc on line, but, that feel of "what is it like to sit in", isn't available.

You absolutely need seat time.  Make a short list of 3-5, and drive them all, then drive the finalists again.  You should have a ballpark of what each will cost, to factor into the equation.  Then use the APA to buy the winner.  Simple, and they don't even pressure you to buy the extended warranty or fabric protection.

My 2004 Corolla got t-boned in a shopping centre parking lot.  Until then I was very happy with it.  Went to a car auction when the insurance adjuster said they would not repair the Corolla because of damage to the suspension -- bought a 2007 Pontiac G5 with 48000 km on it for less than the payout on the Corolla.  Feels similar to the Corolla, and gets similar mileage on the highway which is where I do most of my driving..  For people who don't mind a little risk-taking, car auctions can be fun places to go.

I really like the look of the new Cobalt, and the Malibu  or Buick (I am not sure which one was discussed on the radio a couple of weeks ago) has the best service record of any make of car.

Our 2001 Ford Windstar has enough Km's to have gone to the moon and back.  We're looking too.  Ford, in their wisdom, has quit making mini-vans, and the Edge is just too darn pricey.  So, we've been looking at quite few models.  Front runner seems to be the Pontiac Montana (3 or 4 years old).  I've heard they good mileage (for vans) and the Pontiac 3.8 litre V-6 is a well proven, almost bullet-proof mill.

But there's also the Corvette......

If you live close to Calgary, Regal Auctions can be a fun place to get a sample of what is available and a rough measure of current market values of various vehicles.

The Montana is a nice looking vehicle.

Go with the Chrysler over the GM for a used van.

A good place to talk cars online without a "racer"-type mentality is www.autos.ca (used to be www.canadiandriver.com)

Edit:  From that forum, a post I made about my experiences buying cars:

http://www.autos.ca/forum/index.php/topic,51690.0.html

The post is 4 years old, long, and decidedly written by me, which means some will laugh and others will hate it and go back to yelling at neighbourhood children.  Take that into consideration when deciding whether or not to click the link, but I've been told it does have some very good info about how to approach car buying.

After our minivan broke down in Grand Falls, NB in the middle of a Toronto-Halifax trip, we had to rent a car for a day while it was repaired.  We rented a Toyota Yaris, which we were pleasantly surprised with.

So pleasant, in fact, that that's the car I own now.  It's my first car, and I love it dearly.  We haven't had any major problems with it, its gas efficiency is phenomenal, and it always surprises people how spacious inside it feels considering its little size.  It was bought second-hand, barely used, and we have put many a mile on it since.  My husband is now the primary driver, driving it nearly 160km every day in commute on the highway.  He loves it as much as I do.  It has treated us very well, and we would highly recommend it to anyone.

Didn't have to but got to.  I had a 2009 Toyota Camry Hybrid.  It would be coming off lease in June 2012.  I drive between 30 & 35K each year so mileage was a huge factor.  (Lease only allowed for 24K/year).  I had an opportunity to upgrade to a new car and take back lease early with no penalty.  I held out for the exact same car except that I got the upgrade package (GPS, USB port, leather seats, back-up camera).  Payments were only slightly higher and my insurance went down.  I LOVE my Camry - especially the hybrid engine.  I use the same amount of gas as a sub-compact with excellent fuel economy AND I have the luxury of a bigger car.

Absolutely!  I drive more than the average person.  My trip to church is one hour each way.  My carbon footprint is too large and so anything that I can do to lower it, I try and do.  Public transit is not an option in my career and if I took PT to church, I would need to start Saturday evening in order to get there in time...cms

I am in my second Focus (third if you count the year I drove my mom's focus) and have loved the reliability and feel of all three.  Of these three and my dad's Focus none of them has had a major repair (two were totalled off and I still own one).  The only knock I really have is that the mileage drops noticably in the winter.  Also they make a hatch back again.

This is in reply to someone earlier I believe Ford is going to start selling mini-vans again this year sometime. 

As a completely uniformed aside the Ford Fiesta is supposed to be really snappy and fun.  I am always a little leary of new models as they sometimes have some small kinks to work out over the first few years.

PEace

Joel

 hi, long time no see, preecy.

thanks for all the wisdom.  I have a two week reprieve, as am travelling next week.

Have also decided to get the car fixed, so that I can then take my time to either get a used or figure out the new one.

Joel - regarding the Fiesta:  the model's not new.  Fiestas have been in Europe for, like, ever.  If there are any blips in design, it's more from the North American tweaks than anything else.

My parents are looking at getting one, and I went along for a test drive.  I gotta say, I like how my Yaris rides better, but if gas mileage is your aim, the six-speed automatic actually get better mileage than the manual.  Plus I live in Oakville -  a Ford town.  Keeping things local is greener than expensive importing.

Our last purchase was two years ago.  We looked for the car with the best mileage that was also able to take a Daria stroller (stuff for disabled people doesn't come with the normal perks, like foldability).  We ended up with a Mazda 5.  I would have liked to be able to buy smaller, but what can you do.

The 5 has some significant drawbacks that may be present in other cars.  If you are a stick shift driver (and if you aren't, you aren't really driving....), the 5 has a fancy new hydraulic clutch.  Which is supposed to be awesome, unless it isn't.  They aren't adjustable like a normal clutch, so even the smallest slipping means a full replacement, for a LOT of money.  Clutches aren't covered under warranty, so even when your car has only 20k on it, you are SOL.

Also, they come only with alloy wheels.  Which may be stylish, but bend stupid easy.  If you drive in cow country as much as I do, that can be an issue.  Also, expensive to fix.

Our car has an issue which causes the engine light to come on in cold weather.  I am told this is "normal", and that it just has a hard time below -15.  Which, given where I live, means I see a lot of engine light.

It is a good car in lots of ways too, but it is these kinds of details that you don't think about when buying a car.

As for the faith question, now that I am down to only 30k or so a year, my consumption and pollution footprint is smaller.  But if we could have afforded it, or if there had been an option in the size we needed, we would have bought a hybrid.  As it was, those were the concerns that drove us to find the best mileage possible given our other restraints.

 So, i forgot one factor....which may mean that I am going to drive this for another year.

I have a 17yr old who is working on his license.  In one year, he will be approaching getting out of school and being in the reserves/school.

I had chosen to fix the car, and would drive it while I looked.  

Now, I think I will fix the car, and drive it, until he needs a car.

<duplicate post>

 Note: I drove a Sentra this week as a rental.  Definitely liked it.  It was automatic, but, the interior was a nice design.  Good pickup.  Reasonable price range.  Had my sister & her daughter in the car, with lots of room.  Seats were comfortable.  Nice little extras in the design. 

Also drove a Hyundai...and reminded me again that I don't like driving them.

 Update:   I asked a small shop in the country to give a quote.  This shop is owned by a  a "kinda relative" who I used to have do all my automobile work.    He said he figured he could do it between $1000 and $1500..which was much better than $2300 from the dealership.  

I left it with him while I travelled last week, and picked it up tonight.  The bill was under $600.   Now, he didn't do all the work that the dealer was going to do....but the work the dealership was going to do was not what was broken, just what htey figured would break when they did the job.

So...I am thrilled.   I can afford a few more of these kind of bills and still come out way ahead of a new car or even a 2 year old car.   So, my Toyota will probably be passed on to YoungestSon, and be making more trips to the little country automotive shop.  

We bought a new car a couple of years ago, a dark blue Hyundai Elantra GL.

We prayed about it. We believe that God led us to purchase from a friend of my wife's who worked for a Hyundai dealership and landed us a sweet deal.

Our faith in each other was also a part of the purchase. The deal between my wife and I was that she got to pick the car, I got to choose the colour. I really wanted to pick something like lime green or blaze orange but those are not stock colours.

Does God also lead you to a washroom when you have to go?  Does he lead you to the correct aisle every time in Walmart and Home Depot?

Not always, and no.

Why not?  I mean, He apparently lead you to someone your wife already knew, to get a good deal on a car.  You do a better job of satirizing God than I ever have.  I almost look up to you.

You'd better return that car and get it fixed, snp.   Obviously the radio is tuned to the wrong station.

Hi Seeler,

I don't know about there being anything wrong with the radio.

It appears that the mechanic already showed that the defective part was the operator.  

Grace and peace to you.

John

good joke SNP, even if I'd tweak the ending myself. 

Pinga - that is a good ending (or rather, continuation).... Looking at new cars is fun.  Paying for them isn't.

Birthstone - its a good thing that people are different.  You enjoy looking at new cars.  I get a pain in the pit of my stomach whenever Mr. Seeler starts driving around the dealerships.   Your final four words hit home with me:  "Paying for them isn't."

Mr. Seeler and I have completely opposing views about buying a car.  He thinks he should buy new, or nearly new, keep it until it is nearly paid for, and trade it while it still has some tradein value.    For most of his life he has been making car payments - and of course that is the way with many people.  Do they realize how much of each monthly payment goes for interest to the banks rather than purchasing the car.  

I try to tell him - get a car that will last at least ten years.  Pay it off in four.  Continue banking the same amount in car payments for the next six years.  Trade in (or privately sell) the old car, and pay cash for a new car.  You'll still have money in the bank.  Start setting aside something each month for the next ten years, and you will be able to pay cash for every car you buy for the rest of your life.  

We've been married for almost 50 years now.  I think we will have to agree to disagree - and I will have those stomach pains every three or four years when the new-car bug comes around again.

Seeler, from an economic perspective, you're absolutely right, of course.

Now, stop using "Your Jae is showing", or at least pay me royalties.

ah Seeler, I guess that I dont' have much hope in getting to car-shop very often.  And I'm excellent at window-shopping, meaning that I learned a long time ago to not even wish that I could buy all the cool stuff, so I just admire and move on.

Now cars.... they are kinda shiny, and some have pretty lines, or heated seats.... so I have my favourites, but I'll settle for my vehicle as it is - paid off and in good shape for a few years to come.