I wonder about the grief experienced by children and the depths of their pain as they try to move forward. This spring we lost a cherished member of our extended family when a 15 year old boy was struck by a train and died a week later from severe head trauma. His 9 year old half brother (my grand nephew) is struggling to understand the "why". He loved his brother and misses him terribly and expresses that pain from time-to-time.
As adults, I don't think we can begin to understand how children feel, but hopefully encouraging them to talk about it helps.
Do the 7 stages apply to children...I wonder?

Actually what I have seen, gecko, says children's stages are indeed different.

The following is culled from http://singleparents.about.com/od/communicatingwiththekids/a/stages_of_grief.htm

They also have advice for each stage.

The Four Stages of Grief in Children Include:

Shock and Numbness
Whether your child is coping with a loss due to death, or the news of an impending divorce or separation, he or she is likely to be stunned at first. On the surface, it may appear that your child is functioning fairly well. However, beneath the surface, he or she is just beginning to cope with the loss. For this reason, your child's ability to think clearly and concentrate may be impaired during this stage in the grieving process.

Yearning and Searching
During this stage, your child may appear restless, angry, or bewildered; or express feelings of guilt over the loss. These intense and unresolved feelings may result in the child acting out toward others, or completely withdrawing from his or her social and family connections.

Disorientation and Disorganization
During this stage, your child may experience extreme sadness or depression over the loss. He or she may also continue to experience feelings of guilt or anger while the reality of loss continues to "sink in." This may manifest itself in your child's loss of appetite, sleeplessness, and lack of enthusiasm for things he/she used to enjoy.

Reorganization and Resolution
During this stage, your child begins to accept the loss and assimilate it into his or her life. In addition to noticing that your child seems less sad, you may also notice that he or she has more energy and is able to think more clearly again.
 

Gecko, I think we all have trouble with "why?". Often, the things we are told make it worse not better. I still recall the things I was told about my dad dying when I was young. I wish instead of all the "God needed him" and other stuff they had simply said, "it doesn't make sense" or "there is no reason".

but I always thought that I'd see you again, 

From my own experience of grief I'd like to suggest that, although these listed stages of grief occur - one doesn't necessarily work through one stage and then proceed to the next.  There are days when many of the stages are experienced in an heightened emotional state.

Anger was  one emotion that I found bewildering.

I had heard that there are folks who are angry with God, angry with the medical profession - even angry with their partners for leaving them to face life alone. I felt none of these.

Apart from the odd outburst, I am by nature not an angry person.

When John died I didn't expect anger - so when it came I felt lost.

Who was this strange woman who had taken over my mind?

If anything happened that was unexpected I seemed to erupt into anger. I remember yelling at a man who didn't want to wait his turn at the supermarket checkout, telling my sister off when all she did was invite me to her holiday home, getting angry with the chemist for making an error in my prescription........

But, my main focus for my anger was this elderly next door neighbour.

What was her crime? She was too kind.

John died five days before my birthday. Knowing it was my birthday she arranged and paid for a relaxing massage.

Soups and casseroles were prepared and given to me.

Inexplicably I found myself getting angry with her, culminating in me telling her tersely that she didn't need to cook for me, I was capable of doing it myself.

After that outburst, I burst into tears and realised what lay behind my anger.

I didn't want her kindness, I wanted John.

Although she later told me she understood - I still feel bad about the way I treated this poor woman.

I mention this, because although depression, sadness and loss of energy are expected from relatives and friends - they often don't expect the anger that grief can cause.

Naturally, when this anger is turned on them, they feel hurt and upset.

After all, they're just trying to help.

Under more normal circumstances when we help another they usually show appreciation. It may not be like this if the person you're helping is experiencing grief - so try not to take it personally.

The other thing I'd like to add is one way that helped me to adjust to John's death was the realisation that  it was life that we shared - and it was a disservice to him to stay "stuck" in grief.

To me, that would be like saying his death was more important to me than the life we shared. 

It wasn't.

This is one of my favourite songs. I almost posted it on your other thread, Pinga.

Thanks for starting this thread. I will have to think about it some more before I respond directly to the comments.

Thank you for this place, Pinga

and, though, we can't be there physically, you know we will be here for you.

For those feeling down...especially those who are unable to sleep.......

If We Could Bring You Back Again

If we could bring you back again,
For one more hour or day,
We’d express all our unspoken love;
We’d have countless things to say.

If we could bring you back again,
We’d say we treasured you,
And that your presence in our lives
Meant more than we ever knew.

If we could bring you back again,
To tell you what we should,
You’d know how much we miss you now,
And if we could, we would.

By Joanna Fuchs

I do not know how to imbed it, but this song is one of those ones.....

Another is this one... ( a favourite of friends who cope with early onset Parkinson's and one of those long goodbyes)

There are great videos, but the words mean something and reading them means more to me.

SG, I finally figured out what my issue was..i had to refresh, so let me help you by embedding these wonderful additions

While a heuristic list and helpful there is now a new look at grief where the list is questioned. Questioned because it looked like one had to experience each stage and there was working through the stages.   In empirical studies this does not happen and there is pluralism of responses and they can be random.  Yes, children experience grief in different ways ( A friend who studies this says sending grief counselors into a school makes things worse)

If we remember it is a heuristic list it can help and as was said to the why question - some factual information helps and to answer the existential question with God wanted it makes it worse.  Death is  natural and unexpected and not wanted - breaks our hearts - gives relief.  We have mixed emotions.  When dealing with the why question, in seeking an answer,those answers that suggest no rationale or does not make sense or shit happens - we are also undone - are better than God called the best.

The problem with the list or stages is if one does not go through them or are forced to then one can perceive they have a problem.  The best is to listen to the felt needs and be a strong support -

For example there are times when death is welcomed - here grief is different - relief and missing the person.  Then are times when we are prepared and the grief is there for the loss which may have begun before the death.  Unexpected deaths bring their own and different responses, here it may be shock and loss- deeper loss because it is unexpected.

On the reading I have done with children and grief it could be a pet, as well as a family member or friend.

With teens , it said, not to be worried if they want to spend time with peers and not family. For them it helps.

These are just some thoughts.

Thanks Pan.  This is one of those times when I wish I could change the opening post..and yet....there is also a benefit for this nuggests of wisdom which keep popping into the thread.    Why?  As we hear messages ..or wonder, this thread is hear reminding us there is no one true journey, no right way...and so many differing understandings.  Thanks for that, Pan.  

ch, i think your post, mirrors my thoughts, re the various reasons and ways that we grieve.

We do not get over grief.

But over time, we do learn to live with the loss.

We learn to live a different life...with our loss.

wow, what an amazing piece of art, thanks for both the comments and the image

Just a nuance - living with the loss is getting over grief - grief is more specific the heart broken moment - one could be stuck in grief which is not helpful.

(a native american elder was asked,"what shall we do if we get lost?")

                                            LOST

Stand still. The trees before you and the bushes beside you are not lost,

Where ever you are is a place called here,

and you must treat it is a powerful stranger,

both asking to know and be known.

Listen. The forest whispers,

"I have made this place, you can leave and return once again

saying, here".

No two trees are the same to Raven,

No two branches are the same to Wren,

If what a tree or a branch does is lost on you,

You are truly lost.

Stand still. Listen.

The forest knows where you are,

Let it find you.

(arrangement by David Wagoner)

May I recommend Ruth Davis Konigsberg's 'The Truth about Grief: The myth of its five stages and the new science of loss'?

(Maybe you've read this, Pan?)

She has written a very thorough review of the science and the realities of grief and concludes that the Kübler-Ross's "five stages" (that turned to seven and more stages) are fallacies that have been turned into commercially fruitful truisms, helping undertaking to become as lucrative as wedding planning.

The science reveals that, psychologically, we're pretty well set up to cope with loss and that the whole business of grief counselling and its tenets can prolong and add pain to the the whole process — but its great for the counsellors' income security.

I am familiar with the New Zealand Maori cultural approach which traditionally covers threes days… very briefly described as: 1) the coming together of extended family and community 2) the commemoration of and grieving for the deceased person 3) the banishing of the deceased's spirit from the community and closing of the social gap that's left. I have experienced this. There is wailing and weeping and intense emotion at the start and amazing release at the end. It's long seemed to me to be a very healthy, effective and "efficient" way to re-establish the balances that are disturbed by a death.

Because families and communities are involved when one is born or dies, these moments are culturally mediated and supported. Many cultures also publicly mark puberty, the taking on of new roles, etc. Some mark divorce as well as marriage. With our more private, invidualistic ways, we're less skilled, I think, at being borne through life's challenges by our communities, and our "rites of passage" become expensive exhibitions of personal status: think of weddings, funerals,  baby showers, graduations…  many cultures make these community rather than personally costly transitions.

Mike -- not sure where you get the idea that we are setup for grief, and that counseling is inappropriate.  having been there, when i was definitely in trouble comng up to an anniversary, a counsellor helped me move through. maybe if we lived in tribes, i wouldn't have needed it..however, since we don't, i did.

waterfall .... thank you .... that brought tears to my eyes ...

I shall keep that treasure...

Hugs

Rita

Your welcome Rita, it brought an obvious truth to my heart when I first read it too.

Pinga... where did I get the idea?

I said:

It was Ruth Davis Konigsberg's 'The Truth about Grief: The myth of its five stages and the new science of loss'. You may find it a helpful, empowering and freeing read, or you may not.

Her research was based in the U.S. It is sound, well based research, relevant to us and our culture.

The N.Z. stuff is out of my personal experience.

Thanks for the music and encouragement everyone! Music is very therapeutic.

Okay...I removed mine too...I just thought it relevant due to the description of stages of grief...but I will stay on track here.

Art is good for a lot of woes...it's healing and inspiring and proactive.

<snip> - removing this post, as focussing on the initial thread...art for grief

I've posted this elsewhere...for those like me 'grieving" about current events and issues...a new thing (new to me) I'm learning about:

http://www.artforsocialchange.net/home.html

Thanks for the link, Kimmio.  Very interesting and hopefully will inspire change.

First, I would just like to say that in my experience everyone grieves differently and I think individuals should know its ok if they are not experiencing what the "experts" are telling them they should - yes that is the voice of experience.

So from my own personal way to grieve,  I always found solace, comfort and, even provocation, in art and music.  As the process of grieving unraveled, or maybe knitted, my tastes would evolve from dark to light.

During what I hope was the darkest time of my life, I was drawn to the paintings of Andrew Wyeth and Alex Colville.  Their imagery was consistently that of loneliness and aloneness.  Incredibly spending time with these images allowed me to move on.

A particular favourite  was Alex Colville's Horse and Train.  I would go regularly to the AGO and look at it.  This painting captured my feelings precisely....

The progression to light was when I could see that the horse could leave the tracks.

Its funny, not in a ha ha way but a hmmm, that years later, as I was dealing with the loss of a friend, the horse imagery would return when I found comfort in this poem...

Ride a wild horse
with purple wings
striped yellow and black
except his head
which must be red.

Ride a wild horse
against the sky
hold tight to his wings

before you die
whatever else you leave undone—
once ride a wild horse
into the sun.

Hannah Kahn