I ask the same question, Crazy.

Denial? We don't want to see our own imperfections, so we go looking for the imperfections of others? A couple quick thoughts, but hardly answers.

Liberals (like many of the UCCers here and UUs like myself) are often just as bad as conservatives for fault-finding and finger-pointing, even if the faults we point up are different ones. I think it's something that we all should be wrestling with and asking ourselves more often. And yes, I'm including yours truly in that.

Mendalla

like mendalla said, my vote is that we often judge others cause it takes the spotlight from ourselves...with all our faults and flaws.

sometimes i find myself hanging on sooo tight to my opinion or idea that i dig in deeper and deeper even when i've changed my mind or am divided on an issue.

  i am working hard on being open cause i know, i know i know (knocking myself on the noggin as I type) that when I stay open, i come into deeper relationship with whoever it was that I was trying to hard to shut out - be that a friend, stranger, myself or God.

Hi crazyheart,

Even though I am imperfect I am not absolutely confused about what is right and what is wrong.

Judging another to be imperfect is not the same thing as saying that they are worse than me, although that probably happens more often than I'd like.  It means that I recognize they are not doing something right and I know what that wrong thing is.

Now, if I know something is wrong and I do nothing have I contributed to the good or multiplied the bad?  Do I wipe the sin away by shrugging my shoulders and saying, "Nobody is perfect?"

What if the wrong I see is a child being abused.  Should I hold my tongue and not judge because I am imperfect?

What if the wrong I see is cheating on taxes.  Should I hold my tongue and not judge because I am imperfect?

When does my imperfection become you license to do what you want to whomever you want?

We are not told not to judge.  We are told that the standard of judgment we apply to others will be used against ourselves.  If I am a vengeful judge then I can expect to be judged by the same level of vengeance.  If I refuse to judge because I don't care about the integrity of the other I can expect that I don't matter that much to another judge either.

It is just as hypocritical to allow wrong to happen unchecked when we know it is wrong as it is to judge others with harsher criticism than we apply to ourselves.

Grace and peace to you.

John

The short answer is that it's just what humans do.

Perhaps for us to negotiate our way in this world we have to define a construct of morality. Once established, we tend to defend it - as it can cause great personal upheaval to change a construct.

One way to defend our personal moral code is to attack (perhaps punish) those who do not uphold our values.

One of the unseen values of overseas travel is that it gives one a chance to see and understand that a lot of our values are culturally driven. A lot of these, as such, can often be downgraded in importance.

This is not to say we should throw out the baby with the bath water.

I, for one, happen to believe in the Golden Rule. To me, that's not negotiable.

When one does not have a firm opinion, one gains less respect,  even jeering and put downs. I sometimes find it hard to stick to a view, and feel I know nothing.

I also find that when I do assert an opinion, I know that it is highly subjective, moulded by persuasion and influence, and so is everyone else's opinions, and thus nothing matters and nothing is real. So, I try not to think too much!

On the other hand, there are many things I know to be wrong, and feel justified in critisizing someone elses view that oposes those. So I do know something! : )

I also know that it is no good to be wishy washy and manipulable. There is a fine balance to be found between judgement and non-judgement.

Does that make any sence?

"Why do we put ourselves in the seats of judgement?"

Probably because we think we are "enlightening" others to our own viewpoint.

LIke PP said it could be cultural or as Rev. John stated our learned experience of what's right or wrong. I think moral evolvement can be selective ot even determined by the time frame or even the country that we are born into.

Law is introduced to protect the public as a whole, so the law is what judges man in this world.

The law is flawed though.

Just like we are.

To put a man to death is a judgement that no man should undertake, for there is no room for flaws in such a judgement as this.

If we freely without remorse put another to death, we may find such judgement for ourselves.

We must search our hearts to discover the motives for any judgement we put on any human being.

For we ourselves may find ourselves to be judged in the same way.

We who are spiritual judge all "things", but judgeing life & death for mankind is better left to One who is qualified.

Bolt

Hi crazyheart:

What, Human Inperfection? Freudian slip, eh?

Inwardly we are all perfect, but not outwardly, eh?

I guess Arm, typos are to have some meaning.

You're all wrong, I am perfect in EVERY way! I am filled with humility, I am not arrogant, I see everyone equally.

(And this makes me better than you.)

I don't believe we have any right on our own to do that. I believe we should turn to the Bible as our source of objective morality.

(And I say that as someone who is more perfect than most. )

I was just thinking that was a fantastic thread title.

So true, Mendalla.   And wherever we find ourselves on the theological spectrum, we can be intolerant towards those who think differently.  I agree with you totally.

"I'm only human

of flesh and blood I'm made

Human

born to make mistakes

I am just a man."

-Human League

Aaagh! Eighties flashback!

Mendalla