crazyheart's picture

crazyheart

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Throw out baby with bath water?

This from the Uncomfortable In Church thread

"Christmas Eve - I have seen communion served in a church where there was only one Christmas Eve Service - filled with strangers - most were unused to the ritual of the church - they looked very uncomfortable. I think this leads me to start another thread." CrazyHeart

 

So what I am wondering is how much of ritual and music and readings and other things  should we give up to be welcoming to others who come to the church?

 

Should churches have to give these things up? Is there another way to welcome folk without disrupting the flow of the Sunday Morning Service that parishioners are use to?

Or do we have to thrown out the baby with the bath water?

 

Any ideas?

 

 

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waterfall's picture

waterfall

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There are three areas in the church I attend. One is the live main service, then there is a chapel that is smaller with the service in video and then there is a coffee shop with the service in video.

You can pick which one is more comfortable.

No protocol in the coffee shop, just have to listen  if you want.

spiritbear's picture

spiritbear

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CH - in many cases, the baby hasn't received a bath in a very long time. The intransigent attitude towards change is just a measure of creative laziness in my opinion. But regarding your point about a Christmas Eve service, we have an earlier, less formal one and a later one (with communion).  Those less familiar with "traditions" tend to go to the earlier one. But then, I'm very familiar with traditions and I go to the early one too, because for me those traditions stand in the way of finding worship meaningful.

rishi's picture

rishi

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Here's a sermon outline that might help:

 

(1)  The challenge with the baby/bathwater metaphor is that it makes the process that it points to seem quite simple.  After all, who couldn't discern the difference between a  literal baby and literal bathwater? 

 

(2) But if no one is really quite sure what the baby looks like, or if what is baby for me is bathwater for you, then what do we do? 

 

(3) The approach of Jesus to much of the organized religion of his day seems to have been to just come out and call it as he saw it:  "There's nothing here but bathwater, folks..."  or "Here's how to recognize the baby: ....."

 

(4) This reminds me of something that happened Christmas Eve (or whenever) in our congregation.

 

(5)  How do you think we should respond to this situation we seem to find ourselves in?

 

 

GordW's picture

GordW

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When one talks about days like Christmas where there is a higher percentge of people who are not regularly in church some studies show that it is MORE important to them to have "church like it used to be".

 

Certainly regular attenders are more apt to understand newer worship patterns (assuming they have been exposed to them of course) and feel comfortable with something less traditional.  Where I see this most obviously is in discussions around waht to sing at funerals....

seeler's picture

seeler

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I tend to agree with Gord here.  Generally people have an idea about what to expect in church, and while regular attenders may get used to each change as it is introduced over time, those who only attend occasionally or on special occasions like Christmas will probably expect church to be at least something like what they have pictured in their minds:  a few familiar hymns, a scripture read, reflection, prayer, etc. 

 

I knew one family who had been away from church for a few years, went to the early Christmas eve service at my church - the one that is intended for families with young children.  They didn't understand when, after the opening greeting, short prayer and a carol, the minister invited the entire congregation to join the children on a journey.  Then they were off to various rooms in the church, where they were greeted by people in costume, playing various parts of the Christmas story until finally they ended up in a stable with real parents and a real baby, playing the part of the holy family.  They had birthday cake and drinks.  That was the service.  Those who choose not to join in the journey found themselves sitting by themselves in the empty sanctuary.  Not at all what they had expected.

 

And on another occasion I invited a young Buddhist to come with me to church, he wanted to see the rituals, what usually went on in our worship service.  He was very interested in observing a baptism.  I don't remember if I ever invited him on a communion Sunday.

 

I think it is possible to make the church a welcoming place without throwing out our traditions and our usual forms of worship.  And that isn't saying that they can't be changed over time - new hymns learned, other forms of music, occasional drama, or dialogue in place of the message. 

 

 

Arminius's picture

Arminius

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As I said on other threads, we have traditional services in our sanctuary and alternative gatherings in our hall. If attendees from the hall want to attend traditional services, and feel uncomfortable, then they get some coaching on the routine.

 

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